Author Topic: Joel Smith's one-leg jump peak program  (Read 12128 times)

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Raptor

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Re: Joel Smith's one-leg jump peak program
« Reply #15 on: June 23, 2011, 12:23:31 pm »
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Well in the past the shock and collapse would've happen in the VMO area. Right now the shock and feeling of weakness when the collapse occurs happens in the lower part of the hamstring of the left leg (I can feel the part just above the knee stiffen up and giving up and the knee goes forward). So interestingly enough, the quad doesn't feel overload but instead that ^^^ happens.

So, like I said, maybe the hamstring contracts eccentrically to prevent hip collapse and as the hamstring contracts the quad needs to relax - and this leads to the knee going forwards.

Because the hip can collapse too (get too low) and maybe that's happening. No idea if I'm right or not.

Lance was hinting towards the hamstring not being able to maintain the same length during the plant if I'm right but still, what does that have to do with the knee? Maybe if the hamstring contracts more on the knee end then knee flexion occurs and that's it - the knee goes forward and collapses into the jump.

Raptor

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Re: Joel Smith's one-leg jump peak program
« Reply #16 on: June 24, 2011, 06:45:58 pm »
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By the way - I need an alternative for this since I can't bound on my right leg due to knee issues. So that's not possible. I can bound LLLL but any landing on the right now flares the thing up and pain comes. I might be able to do LLRR though, but LRLR is undoable due to lack of technique.

I was wondering if max jumps and long jumps could be substituted with some of the one leg bounds.

Also, the plan is the use the weight vest for actual dunks.

Joel Smith

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Re: Joel Smith's one-leg jump peak program
« Reply #17 on: June 25, 2011, 12:41:35 pm »
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You can definitely have simulaneous contractions of your quad and hams during jumping.  I think your problem lies in the recruitment patterns of your VMO and lateralis.  The low hamstring weakness/collapse makes no sense in terms of that leading to knee collapse.  Well it is an interesting note.... the hamstring is an antagonist to the knee extension in jumping, but an agonist to the hip extension you need.  Of course, the primary driver of hip extension in single leg jumping, as well as the stronger muscle is the glute group.  I suppose if your hamstrings were too active during the eccentric loading of the quad, that could lead to buckling, but whose motor programming would have them do that?  Personally, I think it is more motor patterns and inter/intramuscular coordination rather than direct strength which are leading to your problems.  How is your glute strength?  Perhaps if your glute group wasnt strong enough your hamstring would have to get recruited extra for hip extension?

Maybe try this test for me, try a track and field long jump and see what happens with your leg if it buckles.  The hamstring is going to be more active in that than a dunk attempt. 


Joel Smith

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Re: Joel Smith's one-leg jump peak program
« Reply #18 on: June 25, 2011, 12:42:16 pm »
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Also, what is the injury pathology on your right knee?

Raptor

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Re: Joel Smith's one-leg jump peak program
« Reply #19 on: June 25, 2011, 03:16:42 pm »
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I think I tend to fail more in a long jump than in a dunk attempt, but that's just a guess. It also depends on the amount of speed I use.

Maybe when I first started to jump I used a lot of hamstring and over time I remained "hooked" to that even though I have stronger glutes now than back then. I think there's a "big" difference when I do lunges for example, I can feel the right glute work so much better functionally than the left glute.

As for my knee - haven't done an MRI yet. Costs a lot. But it just "clicks" in the lateral side when I go from ~10 degrees to ~25 degrees of flexion. Probably (I think it is) some sort of ITB syndrome. Not sure if it is though. I can't squat high bar since after 1 or 2 reps my knee hurts like hell. But I can squat low bar.

Raptor

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Re: Joel Smith's one-leg jump peak program
« Reply #20 on: June 26, 2011, 06:13:00 pm »
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I'm going to start to do this since tomorrow :D

Not sure what my right knee will think about it but...

mherold

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Re: Joel Smith's one-leg jump peak program
« Reply #21 on: July 03, 2011, 02:55:14 am »
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Yesterday was my test after the first phase. I was able to get my bodyweight down to 143 from 146-147.  It felt good to be a bit leaner but I def could have been even leaner and stronger. I jumped about 1.5 to 2 inches higher than ever but I am still at least 3 to 5 inches from the rim. I think the program is effective but think it is very quadricep dominant.  I am sure that was part of the intention since much of the ability of the single leg jump is the absorption of high speed at the plant. However, I really felt it in only quads after awhile.  I followed the program to a T but last sunday I did way too much fitness stuff. I had to help a lady whose electric wheel chair broke and I pushed her about a mile. It was a helluva a workout and helped with weight loss but not ideal the week before peaking. Not sure how much that affected things since I did not jump until Friday. Legs felt it though and on the same day I did a lot of extra fitness stuff.

Any advice? I just dont have the power yet off of one leg at my weight and structure. Thanks.

Raptor

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Re: Joel Smith's one-leg jump peak program
« Reply #22 on: July 03, 2011, 07:06:30 am »
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Well as far as I'm concerned, I HAVEN'T followed the program to a T plyo wise... since my right knee is idiotic and I can only do LLLL bounds, it didn't make too much sense to waste time to go to the track and do that so I went in the park instead since basketball is "some sort" of plyo in itself. Yes, I know.

I think I'm going to modify the plyo day and do LLLL for a few sets and then go with double leg bounds until a 5% dropoff happens.

Joel Smith

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Re: Joel Smith's one-leg jump peak program
« Reply #23 on: July 03, 2011, 11:24:00 am »
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Hey Matt, I can help you with switching the format around to cater to your needs, just PM me or something,.  Glad to hear about the gains you are making!  I think that training format is one of the best out there!  I am at 100 pages on my new book which is focused on that specific training block (and a ton of other things) should be done within a month!

Raptor, we need to get that knee of yours fixed up!  You can just bound on your off good leg, and maybe do a bunch of double leg stuff aside from that on the plyo days.  Honestly, you don't even have to bound a ton on the plyo days, just substitute speed work in instead, like 2x20m, 3x30m, 2x40m, and then do a bunch of double leg stuff and use the power jumper from time to time.  You can also do med ball or shot throws with powerful hip extension, that is great too.  It is more the format of the days the exercises are presented, and not quite as much the exercises themselves. 

J

Raptor

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Re: Joel Smith's one-leg jump peak program
« Reply #24 on: July 03, 2011, 01:47:56 pm »
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Yeah I know... I think I'll use the powerjumper as a "weight vest" (in terms of overload) for the two leg jumps (two leg bounds), but it won't work on the single leg bounds due to the non-jumping staying bent and under you so it shortens the power jumper canceling it's tension.

I wonder what happens if I bound on one leg with a med ball in hands? (haha) I should try to somehow switch to a double arm swing... I'll see what I can do.

My usual plyo workout is 3x30m sprint, single leg bounds on my left leg for about 3 or 4 sets of 20m and then 5 double leg bounds for 4-5 sets.

Joel Smith

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Re: Joel Smith's one-leg jump peak program
« Reply #25 on: July 03, 2011, 01:52:56 pm »
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I would recommend pumping up that sprint volume a bit, most american acceleration development days involve about 200-300m of total work.  I had been doing about 250m of work twice a week prior to that VJ pr I hit on video. 

I say this mostly because it will be some good training you can do without bothering your knee so much.. and break you out of the 90m training you typically do...... and I do need to also take your advice and get my squat up to 400lb 8)

Raptor

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Re: Joel Smith's one-leg jump peak program
« Reply #26 on: July 03, 2011, 01:55:24 pm »
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When you see adistarhj do squats (albeit quarter) with 140 you know you need to squat 400 lbs.

As for the sprints, I think you're right. Although I heavily hiperventilate and feel really sick after a few sprints. I'm lately kind of jumping forward instead of up so I need to work on that as well.

Raptor

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Re: Joel Smith's one-leg jump peak program
« Reply #27 on: July 03, 2011, 02:00:53 pm »
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Here are the "depth jumps" off aerobic boxes:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ajdhZV2ji1U" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ajdhZV2ji1U</a>


hennas87

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Re: Joel Smith's one-leg jump peak program
« Reply #28 on: July 07, 2011, 01:20:46 pm »
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I'm quite interested in this program. A while back when I rested for a week I noticed that I could jump higher in the middle of the week and that leads me to believe this program may work well for me.

I'm assuming it wouldn't be a problem if I do some upper body exercises on plyo days e.g. pull ups, bench/press ups, bent over rows, military press etc...
 It wouldn't have a detrimental effect to this program would it? (I wouldn't be training like a bodybuilder and doing loads of slow reps, I try and make them as powerful as I can)
boomshakala

Joel Smith

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Re: Joel Smith's one-leg jump peak program
« Reply #29 on: July 07, 2011, 01:59:34 pm »
+1
not at all, I did upper body on the plyo days the last two years I did it and had no problems.  i would usually split my day up though, and do lifting in the morning and plyos in the evening or vice versa