Author Topic: NBA Playoffs: 2015-2016  (Read 107319 times)

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T0ddday

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Re: NBA Playoffs: 2015-2016
« Reply #120 on: May 31, 2016, 12:49:24 am »
+1
Damn great game again! I really like both squads but I'm feeling for OKC, they're working so hard and playing great team ball. Then GSW comes down the court and it's a flick of the wrist 3pt shot that just looks so easy. Just like that they take the lead despite not having played a great game.

Both teams are worthy of winning the series but I'd just feel bad seeing OKC lose when they've played the better basketball thoughout the series. Damn it's tough. Logically I'm thinking GSW will win with home court, the way they conserve energy, and curry being a better closer than Westbrook. Great stuff though.

Interesting that you think OKC played the better basketball.  I believe GS had more assists, fewer turnovers, higher shooting percentage, etc.  All the hallmarks of what I consider good basketball.

Russell Westbrook really is a force to be reckoned with.  Amazing.  But Kevin Durants reliance on free throws and the thunders attempts to draw shooting fouls on jumpers is really frustrating to watch imo... Also, the fact that they have so many possessions that start with a bad miss and a offensive rebound and put back by one of their garbage collectors is imo just bad basketball...


adarqui

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Re: NBA Playoffs: 2015-2016
« Reply #121 on: May 31, 2016, 12:50:12 am »
0
solid game.

but i must say, I was shocked at OKC for basically giving up in the last minute. That Ibaka foul on Curry was brutal but keep playing.. It was only a 7-pt game when they let Curry dribble around forever without fouling, then let him take a wide open 3-ptr to make it 10. They just gave up.

dno.. I can't respect that.

as for Thompson/Curry, man it's a straight up long distance aerial assault. some of those shots are just mind blowing. so much fun to watch.

CLE @ GSW on Thursday... i'm really glad this is the matchup because I want to see CLE get a chance to redeem themselves with their full squad. I'm almost indifferent as to who wins.. all I know is, if CLE is winning, i'll be rooting for GSW.. if GSW is winning, i'll be rooting for CLE. I love GSW's team, coaching, etc much more than CLE but i'm also a big LeBron fan. I'd be legitimately happy if Lebron won one for CLE.







if I had to make a prediction.. I just can't go against GSW. GSW in 7.

pc!

adarqui

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Re: NBA Playoffs: 2015-2016
« Reply #122 on: May 31, 2016, 12:53:03 am »
0
Damn great game again! I really like both squads but I'm feeling for OKC, they're working so hard and playing great team ball. Then GSW comes down the court and it's a flick of the wrist 3pt shot that just looks so easy. Just like that they take the lead despite not having played a great game.

Both teams are worthy of winning the series but I'd just feel bad seeing OKC lose when they've played the better basketball thoughout the series. Damn it's tough. Logically I'm thinking GSW will win with home court, the way they conserve energy, and curry being a better closer than Westbrook. Great stuff though.

Interesting that you think OKC played the better basketball.  I believe GS had more assists, fewer turnovers, higher shooting percentage, etc.  All the hallmarks of what I consider good basketball.

Russell Westbrook really is a force to be reckoned with.  Amazing.  But Kevin Durants reliance on free throws and the thunders attempts to draw shooting fouls on jumpers is really frustrating to watch imo... Also, the fact that they have so many possessions that start with a bad miss and a offensive rebound and put back by one of their garbage collectors is imo just bad basketball...

westbrook needs to chill with his atrocious flops after jumpers. that 3-ptr where he just imploded on igoudala was pathetic.. and it ended up really hurting OKC, because Klay caught fire directly after that.

and ya I think GSW plays the better basketball.. I think GSW struggled to play their 'beautiful style' vs OKC, definitely.. but what they did vs Portland for example, that absolutely ridiculous ball movement/getting everyone involved, they are a much more impressive team to watch from a basketball-purity standpoint, imho.

ghettoracer

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Re: NBA Playoffs: 2015-2016
« Reply #123 on: May 31, 2016, 12:53:13 am »
0
i can't stand lbj.  never liked him one bit all this time.  gsw all the way.  :)  plus they're my home team afterall...  sfbay.  btw you guys should check out papa greg's sound clip after game 5 (linked below).  he predicted the outcome.  team work + skills > hero ball.  westbrook is a bit too reckless.  he's gotten better over the years but not by much.  he still relies too much on his athletic prowess.  he should learn to slow down...

https://instaud.io/pJr#3:23.7

« Last Edit: May 31, 2016, 12:56:35 am by ghettoracer »
current stats: age: 42 :: 5'11" (180cm) :: 180lbs (82kg) bf ~30% :: reach: 90" or 7'6" (230cm) :: wing span: 6" (183cm)
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status: excellent cardio condition, new 5x5 program, 10' rim touch okay, RVJ ~30"
PR RVJ ~34" 10'5" touch @ age ~25 (worst was ~6" below rim when i was @ 190 lbs ~35% body fat ~23" RVJ in 2007-8

T0ddday

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Re: NBA Playoffs: 2015-2016
« Reply #124 on: May 31, 2016, 01:49:18 am »
0
solid game.

but i must say, I was shocked at OKC for basically giving up in the last minute. That Ibaka foul on Curry was brutal but keep playing.. It was only a 7-pt game when they let Curry dribble around forever without fouling, then let him take a wide open 3-ptr to make it 10. They just gave up.

dno.. I can't respect that.

as for Thompson/Curry, man it's a straight up long distance aerial assault. some of those shots are just mind blowing. so much fun to watch.

CLE @ GSW on Thursday... i'm really glad this is the matchup because I want to see CLE get a chance to redeem themselves with their full squad. I'm almost indifferent as to who wins.. all I know is, if CLE is winning, i'll be rooting for GSW.. if GSW is winning, i'll be rooting for CLE. I love GSW's team, coaching, etc much more than CLE but i'm also a big LeBron fan. I'd be legitimately happy if Lebron won one for CLE.







if I had to make a prediction.. I just can't go against GSW. GSW in 7.

pc!

Agreed.  I can't see GSW not winning but really a series where it's hard to be mad about either team winning. 

Absolutely don't understand how you can hate Lebron (really don't get how you can HATE any player - but Raptors comments about DG are more the rule than the exception) but Lebron is really a good guy, stays out of trouble, loved by teammates, genuinely nice by all accounts and ridiculously talented player.   Most of us would like far worse if we had the world watching us grow up from age 17 till now (I'm lebrons age so I've seen him grow up and can say I would certainly look worse).  Of course latent racism and the concept that he was owned by th cavs is unfortunately present...

If the NBA is going to make one rule change it has to be trying to reduce the number of players drawing fouls on three point shots and long jumpers.  I understand you have to let the player land when he shoots but Westbrook had a shot in game 4 where he jumped and landed on DGs foot which was like 8 feet from where he took off from! 

When a player can shoot a clean three but chooses to jump into a player it really makes the game less beautiful.  I think they should have a rule that a foul is only called when a player makes an attempt to shoot a contact free natural shot and is contacted.  The stopped calling Durants swing through continuation foul as much as they used to but the need to go a little further... If you pump fake and a player leaves his feet and goes sailing by the offensive player should wait for the player to pass and shoot an open shot rather than jump toward the defender and flail... Hard to enforce but one of my least favorite things to watch...

ghettoracer

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Re: NBA Playoffs: 2015-2016
« Reply #125 on: May 31, 2016, 02:09:42 am »
0
lbj's huge ego (calling himself the king, the decision, calling himself the best player last year when he clearly wasn't anymore), the flopping, acting, and the lack of notable improvement in skills over the years.  his shitty footwork, tons of non-called insane travels...  he is elite i'll agree but i just don't like him.  never did, never will.

he simply hasn't grown that much (skill wise) he's the same every year.  i don't like his game one bit.
« Last Edit: May 31, 2016, 02:12:37 am by ghettoracer »
current stats: age: 42 :: 5'11" (180cm) :: 180lbs (82kg) bf ~30% :: reach: 90" or 7'6" (230cm) :: wing span: 6" (183cm)
12 week goal(current): SQ 115kg(100), DL 130kg(110), BP 80kg(70), reduce weight to 75kg (165 lbs) and bf to ~25%
status: excellent cardio condition, new 5x5 program, 10' rim touch okay, RVJ ~30"
PR RVJ ~34" 10'5" touch @ age ~25 (worst was ~6" below rim when i was @ 190 lbs ~35% body fat ~23" RVJ in 2007-8

Coges

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Re: NBA Playoffs: 2015-2016
« Reply #126 on: May 31, 2016, 02:46:55 am »
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the lack of notable improvement in skills over the years. 

How much would you expect him to grow? I'm not sure he has room.
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Coges

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Re: NBA Playoffs: 2015-2016
« Reply #127 on: May 31, 2016, 02:50:55 am »
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If the NBA is going to make one rule change it has to be trying to reduce the number of players drawing fouls on three point shots and long jumpers.  I understand you have to let the player land when he shoots but Westbrook had a shot in game 4 where he jumped and landed on DGs foot which was like 8 feet from where he took off from! 

When a player can shoot a clean three but chooses to jump into a player it really makes the game less beautiful.  I think they should have a rule that a foul is only called when a player makes an attempt to shoot a contact free natural shot and is contacted.  The stopped calling Durants swing through continuation foul as much as they used to but the need to go a little further... If you pump fake and a player leaves his feet and goes sailing by the offensive player should wait for the player to pass and shoot an open shot rather than jump toward the defender and flail... Hard to enforce but one of my least favorite things to watch...

Agreed. They have to look at this over the offseason. This is the most frustrating part of the NBA at the moment. Guys are looking for contact almost every play instead of making the play and absorbing contact if it happens. I always understood that if the offensive player created the contact then it was play on.
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Mikey

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Re: NBA Playoffs: 2015-2016
« Reply #128 on: May 31, 2016, 02:55:07 am »
+1
I'm a Lebron fan so I'm going for the Cavs. It would be great to see Lebron have some success and great for the Cavs franchise. It should be a great series ;D
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Coges

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Re: NBA Playoffs: 2015-2016
« Reply #129 on: May 31, 2016, 02:55:50 am »
0
Btw, I'm devastated OKC didn't win. They had so many chances the last 3 games and poor decisions and stupid plays in each game cost them.
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Mikey

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Re: NBA Playoffs: 2015-2016
« Reply #130 on: May 31, 2016, 02:58:18 am »
+1
Btw, I'm devastated OKC didn't win. They had so many chances the last 3 games and poor decisions and stupid plays in each game cost them.

I was actually going for GWS to win that series with GWS having Bogut. I heard rumours Bogut is going to get traded at the end of the season as well. I don't watch much NBA but out of the OKC v GWS games I did watch, Bogut was disappointing and really didn't do a whole lot on the court.
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ChrisM

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Re: NBA Playoffs: 2015-2016
« Reply #131 on: May 31, 2016, 07:26:15 am »
+2
lbj's huge ego (calling himself the king, the decision, calling himself the best player last year when he clearly wasn't anymore), the flopping, acting, and the lack of notable improvement in skills over the years.  his shitty footwork, tons of non-called insane travels...  he is elite i'll agree but i just don't like him.  never did, never will.

he simply hasn't grown that much (skill wise) he's the same every year.  i don't like his game one bit.

Reallyyyyy not sure why this is being down voted when its factaully quite true. Respect for Lebron for the amazing player he has BUT lets be real here: IF LeBron had MJ or Kobes work ethic we wouldnt be having this conversation or that other one about whot the GOAT. It would be LBJ...hands down. Hes been blessed with a natural athleticism unseen in his sport at his size. But his game HASNT improved except one area. Kobe came back and was better each year at SOMETHING. Same for MJ. They put in work. Lebron? Well, hes said he'll be in the gym over the summer when he has time. Sorry, for a guy with quite a few flaws in his game thats unacceptable to me.

I'll break it down further since im sure someone will ask  :)

The only thing LBJ has gotten better at is  knowing WHEN to shoot the 3 which has given people the surface appearance hes become a better shooter. He hasnt. Hes taking less 3s year by year which not only raises his 3pt fg% but has a marked relationship to overall fg%. This is smart because after 13 years in the league his jumper is still unreliable. So: smart that a 6'9 265lb monster shoots more inside, but it is unacceptable he hasnt worked on his j.

Speaking of shooting, his ft% hasnt trended upward at all. By this point he should easily shoot 83-87% and be dead nuts reliable at the stripe late in games. Hes not. Not once have the cavs been up 2 late in the game and LBJ gets fouled and you say "oh its over, hes icing this". He misses too many big ones.

Next, the hasnt improved his handle at all. His left is eh for a guy who claims to be a point forward. Force him left and he wants to shoot a one dribble step back jumper. He has not go to perimeter move. He lowers his shoulder and drops his head, granted as long as his athletic abilities hold this is a viable option but as weve seen over the last 2 years...hes lost a step and some bounce. He cant blow by everyone now.

He has no go to post move. Necessary if he wants to add years to his game. Pretty self explanatory.

His footwork is atrocious. Im not even talking about the blatant non calls on travels to the rim or pivot foot switches. Im speaking of footwork from the triple threat, or on his pull up jumper, or on his crossover/other dribbled moves. His game screams ultra athletic high schooler who never needed to try and develop more because he was head and shoulders better than his peers.

His defense is sub par, notably on ball. Lebron is NOT a defensive 'stopper'. He gets a lot of hype for his D and the only reason I can see why is because Sportscenter loves his chase down blocks. Watch a game and see how exposed he is on perimeter iso's and PnR situations. His defensive fg% and ppp against on those is nowhere near tops at his position. Watch a game and you can see him give up on plays religiously. He gambles on passing lanes as well like Steph does (without the detractors screaming about it) but comes up with a lot less steals. Point...his D is way over hyped.

I could pull up a bunch of numbers and links to people smarter at this than I but...you get the point. Is he great? Yes. But hes nowhere near where he should be and his flaws will become more and more evident as he gets older and loses his natural ability to dominant athletically. He still has time to develop his footwork, handle and jumper but i dont see it happening based on his work ethic historically.

Dont get me started on his ego. Yes, every great has one but good god...I never saw Larry or Kareem or MJ or Kobe or frankly ANYONE great nickname THEMSELVES. You bust your ass, dominate, and let the media and fans hash out a name for you. You certainly dont name yourself the King your first years in the league or call yourself the best player alive when your DOWN in the finals. Yes, you cant think it, youre SUPPOSED to but you never SAY it! Fuck.

Debates now open lol

BTW my call...GSW in 6. Very definitely can go 7. Cavs arent getting enough respect from the media and fans right now.
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vag

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Re: NBA Playoffs: 2015-2016
« Reply #132 on: May 31, 2016, 09:16:12 am »
+3
I think that the negs came from the distance between "he had the potential to become GOAT but blew it" and "i can't stand lbj.  never liked him one bit all this time."
I can agree with your analysis Chris. He did have the potential to be the new GOAT. And he blew it indeed, it is most probably too late now. And for a basketball lover, someone blowing that rare chance given by nature is a good reason to hate him.

BUT! His career* stats are : 50%FG , 34% 3P 7.2 rebounds 6.9 assists 1.7 steals .8 blocks, 27.2 points.

*CAREER stats guys, 1000 games / 13 years averaging almost 30 points and a triple double, in each and every one of those 1000 games. Come on!

You just can't dislike a this triple-double-averaging dude that randomly elevates his 270lbs body 40+ in the air off one foot. It is disliking one of nature's/evolution's best moments, you just can't.
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undoubtable

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Re: NBA Playoffs: 2015-2016
« Reply #133 on: May 31, 2016, 10:06:38 am »
+2
Lebron is definitely a love him or hate type of dude but I agree you have to respect the athlete that he is. I do wish he cleaned up his footwork though. When he travels and it doesn't called it drives me wild.

All this finals talk has me hyped though. I'll be cheering for GSW but strongly leaning toward Cleveland to win, actually put down a $50 but with my friend.

Storylines:

1. Lebron v Curry - Literally a battle of 1v2 with a fair supporting cast this time for Lebron

2. Can Lebron win one for Cleveland?

3. Will GSW solidify itself as a great franchise to along with the record setting year

++ more I'm sure what do you guys think? I love that players like Adams this year and Delly last year make the headlines
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T0ddday

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Re: NBA Playoffs: 2015-2016
« Reply #134 on: May 31, 2016, 10:52:24 am »
+2
lbj's huge ego (calling himself the king, the decision, calling himself the best player last year when he clearly wasn't anymore), the flopping, acting, and the lack of notable improvement in skills over the years.  his shitty footwork, tons of non-called insane travels...  he is elite i'll agree but i just don't like him.  never did, never will.

he simply hasn't grown that much (skill wise) he's the same every year.  i don't like his game one bit.
Dont get me started on his ego. Yes, every great has one but good god...I never saw Larry or Kareem or MJ or Kobe or frankly ANYONE great nickname THEMSELVES. You bust your ass, dominate, and let the media and fans hash out a name for you. You certainly dont name yourself the King your first years in the league or call yourself the best player alive when your DOWN in the finals. Yes, you cant think it, youre SUPPOSED to but you never SAY it! Fuck.

Debates now open lol

BTW my call...GSW in 6. Very definitely can go 7. Cavs arent getting enough respect from the media and fans right now.

Wow.  I'm a Lebron fan but hats off to Chris M for some excellent scathing criticism of Lebron that is admittedly somewhat convincing.  I'll make my points as to why it's too harsh but unfortunately I have to agree with the spirit of the post.

 I think it's a little too harsh to call him an ultra athletic highschool player who didn't develop - Lebron is light years ahead of someone like Tracy McGrady and even he developed his game quite a bit - the athletic highschoolers who were top picks in the early 2000s and didn't develop didn't last long in the league!  I also think that it's not necessarily fair to claim his lack of footwork or three point accuracy is necessarily an indication that he doesn't work hard.  I've made the point before - that people tend to assume things like jumping ability are entirely God given while shooting and footwork are 100% trainable.  I strongly disagree with this.  I put in a 3-6 months of training to raise my vertical from 35-45 inches but hours of three point shooting and I still am a 30% shooter from the college line at best.  Steph Curry has certainly worked on his shot but he is gifted to shoot the way he does just like Lebron is gifted to be a physical monster.  Maybe Lebron could improve - but his ceiling on his footwork or shooting ability isn't necessarily as high as the top guys in the league and this might be his reality...

Additionally... Could Jordan have been far better if he could shoot the three?  Why do we give Jordan a pass for not figuring out how to add a 45% corner three to his game?  Because the rest of the league hadn't figured it out?  Curry started doing things the league hadn't figured out why not Jordan?  Why do we give Kobe a pass for being physically weak and not being able to play as he got older like Jordan could?  Ever since Kobe fired his last trainer he has been weak as a twig - Phil Jackson even did the main difference with Jordan and Kobe was the Jordan was physically much much stronger and got stronger as he got older while Kobe got weaker... What if Kobe had the strength to post up like Jordan and shoot the turnaround - maybe he could have contributed into his mid to late 30s rather than been the most expensive salary cap killer on a 3 year victory tribute... 

The point is there is no player who does everything right - and it's hard to assume just how much better someone can get at a certain activity because there is no skill that is necessarily achievable for all players with hard work...

However.  Free throws.  This is the best point Chris M makes and I really can't argue with it one bit.  In Magic Johnsons (another player who we don't criticize for not improving footwork) he talks about how despite his set shot and lack of athleticism that he couldn't improve, the one thing he is proudest of is the fact that his free throw shooting went up every single year he played in the NBA and ended up around 90%.  Kawai Leonard raised his free throw shooting to this level during his ascension from good to great as well.  Free throw shooting is probably the most trainable skill in the game - those who put in the practice will shoot well.   The fact that Lebron is a moderate liability when fouled at the end of games is extremely troubling and a sign that he hasn't put in the work to be the best he can be and I don't see any way to mount a defense against that argument... 

That said... Those are fair reasons to be disappointed in LBJ.  Fair reasons for him not to be your favorite player.   My problem with ghettoracers comments is when the narrative is not "Lebron disappoints me because he hasn't elevated his game to the level I think he could" and instead sound like "I just hate that guy as a person.  He's an ass.  The 'decision' made me mad". 

Attacking Lebrons character when the most dirt you have on him is a somewhat immature move that raised a bunch of money for charity seems pretty suspicious to me and smacks of latent racism... Especially when people ignore the fact the Kobe had a rape case, is hated by most of his former teammates, hated by half the league.  The fact the Jordan is by all accounts an asshole and there are a million "this is why MJ is a terrible person stories - google chamillionaires story while none exist about Lebron.  Lebron the person is by all accounts a really nice guy, loved by his teammates, and nice to fans and those below him.  His mistakes come from immaturity and bad advice - I personally know that the best in the world comments came from some misguided advice that he got about being second banana to d wade and needing to more forcefully claim his greatness to inspire his teammates.  It didn't work... But it didn't come from a place of arrogance - it came from immaturity or a lack of savvy which are hardly things to hate...

So, basically I'll give it up to Chris M for a good attack on Lebrons game.  I'm semi convinced by some of it and totally convinced by the free throw argument.  I respect not loving Lebron the basketball player for the lack of improvment he has made... But I have yet to see a good argument to hate or even dislike Lebron the person.  He seems like an only child who just wants to be liked, has stayed married to his middle school sweetheart, has a big heart and is a all around nice guy.  More the exception than the rule in sports today.  If kids pattern their basketball games after the work ethics of Kobe and MJ America might have slightly better basketball players.  But if kids look up to the Lebron James and Magic Johnsons of the NBA we will have better adults in the future... Since most kids don't make it I'd say that's probably worth the trade off...