Author Topic: The Squat Thread  (Read 23255 times)

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mattyg35

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Re: The Squat Thread
« Reply #30 on: March 21, 2010, 11:40:45 pm »
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Thats pretty cool stuff.
Makes sense. I like lifting weights. I remember taking a class in HS and it was about people's proportions, 2/3s of the body was to the hip, and 1/3 obviously was for the rest of the body(hip to top of the head). That was supposed to be the 'ideal' figure. Related to women's waist-to-hip ratio, if you know what that is.
But yeah, people with longer legs, IMO, usually have longer achilles as well(just from having longer legs), which afaik makes someone more predisposed to being a natural jumper.
When I look at the Sittting vs Standing measurements, all it is is biomechanics. Lower SHR = longer femurs, right?
So for me, when I squat, my butt doesn't have to deviate from the body's midline as much.
For the lower SHR guys as well. Most people train their strengths too. Human nature, do whats easier(relatively in this instance). Squatting wasn't for that 'type' but like you said they were more 'natural' jumpers.

adarqui

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Re: The Squat Thread
« Reply #31 on: March 21, 2010, 11:52:55 pm »
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Thats pretty cool stuff.
Makes sense. I like lifting weights. I remember taking a class in HS and it was about people's proportions, 2/3s of the body was to the hip, and 1/3 obviously was for the rest of the body(hip to top of the head). That was supposed to be the 'ideal' figure. Related to women's waist-to-hip ratio, if you know what that is.
But yeah, people with longer legs, IMO, usually have longer achilles as well(just from having longer legs), which afaik makes someone more predisposed to being a natural jumper.
When I look at the Sittting vs Standing measurements, all it is is biomechanics. Lower SHR = longer femurs, right?
So for me, when I squat, my butt doesn't have to deviate from the body's midline as much.
For the lower SHR guys as well. Most people train their strengths too. Human nature, do whats easier(relatively in this instance). Squatting wasn't for that 'type' but like you said they were more 'natural' jumpers.

ya definitely..

as for lower SHR equalling longer femurs, that could be the case, or actually longer tibia's (lower leg). Based on the 2nd chart listed here: http://www.adarq.org/forum/index.php?topic=547.msg3447#msg3447  400m runners has longer tibia's than sprinters & high jumpers had longer thigh lengths (femur). So ya, regardless, SHR is longer legs in general, could be due to femur or tibia.

I think the key beyond just longer legs, is "longer legs in relation to upper body (torso + head)". That is where we're going to see the longer tendons. SHR seems like it can be pretty valuable in this regard.

Those natural limb leverages definitely mold who we are, because as kids, we find certain activities more fun than others, which usually has something to do with our natural leverages & natural physiology. Their are of course outliers but, they are outliers nonetheless. If we took an accurate survey of all the vert-broz on the forums, or basketballers in general, im sure you'd rarely ever find people over 51.

A higher SHR might be better correlated with standing vert though, ie, i've seen a study with asians having on average higher standing verts than blacks and whites. These leverages would also lend themselves more to sports like olympic weightlifting and gymnastics, both of which the "chinese" do very well in.

peace man

mattyg35

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Re: The Squat Thread
« Reply #32 on: March 21, 2010, 11:58:43 pm »
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Thats cool stuff. You're a real scientologist with all of this.
I remember watching a video analysis of Stefan Holm a while ago. It was super interesting, they went all super slow and showed his plant leg and the biomechanics of how he was able to jump so high. Like his tendon was 4x(?) stronger than the average humans, and it could withstand like a half ton of force before it would stretch, something like that. But yeah, it was shitty that I couldn't find it. Have you seen it before? They had one for Asafa Powell too, and he had a Psoas'(I think) that pretty much filled his abdomen it was so big.

adarqui

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Re: The Squat Thread
« Reply #33 on: March 22, 2010, 12:10:59 am »
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Thats cool stuff. You're a real scientologist with all of this.
I remember watching a video analysis of Stefan Holm a while ago. It was super interesting, they went all super slow and showed his plant leg and the biomechanics of how he was able to jump so high. Like his tendon was 4x(?) stronger than the average humans, and it could withstand like a half ton of force before it would stretch, something like that. But yeah, it was shitty that I couldn't find it. Have you seen it before? They had one for Asafa Powell too, and he had a Psoas'(I think) that pretty much filled his abdomen it was so big.

ya i've got the links somewhere, i'll find them.. btw, i have some of those clips in my GALLERIES: High jumpers thread, in this subforum.

ill post a link in a bit to the holm/thomas vid.

holm vs thomas documentary, part 1:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBgdsITpZe8

adarqui

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Re: The Squat Thread
« Reply #34 on: March 22, 2010, 02:34:58 am »
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from kingfish:

36.5" / 70 = 52.1

i can squat deep without much lowerback rounding IMO.
im the only average build here so far Wink





so far the tally is:
--------------------
50.75 (arowe)
51.3 (zgin)
50.7 (adarq)
50.75 (allstar)
50.5 (vag)
51.5 (tychver)
47.8 (rip)
47 (jumper5000)
49.4 (miles)
51.136 (Volleybel)
55.9 (mattyg55)
51.39 (nba8340)
49.5 (raptor)
52.1 (kingfish)

mattyg35

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Re: The Squat Thread
« Reply #35 on: March 22, 2010, 07:01:41 am »
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ya i've got the links somewhere, i'll find them.. btw, i have some of those clips in my GALLERIES: High jumpers thread, in this subforum.

ill post a link in a bit to the holm/thomas vid.

holm vs thomas documentary, part 1:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBgdsITpZe8

That one's super similar to the one I saw.
The one I saw was only Stefan Holm, but the two have the same content.

vag

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Re: The Squat Thread
« Reply #36 on: March 22, 2010, 07:24:50 am »
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tally sorted:

47       (jumper5000)
47,8    (rip)
49,4    (miles)
49,5    (raptor)
50,5    (vag)
50,7    (adarq)
50,75   (arowe)
50,75   (allstar)
51,14   (Volleybel)
51,3    (zgin)
51,39   (nba8340)
51,5    (tychver)
52,1    (kingfish)
55,9    (mattyg55)
woot

Adam.

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Re: The Squat Thread
« Reply #37 on: March 22, 2010, 11:32:02 am »
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Uh, maybe I didn't do it right:

Sitting Height: 39.5"
Standing Height: 73"

SHR: 54.1%

I have shit for ankles so that really effects my depth, but I can, after mobility training squat below parallel without rounding though initially it wasn't possible. Also, I tend to get hip pain when I go below parallel which has not been resolved by the repeated advice that it is a hip flexor length issue.

Jump Video Example:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iae_9qerIuU" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iae_9qerIuU</a>

Squat Video Example:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2NEqLwPCW-g" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2NEqLwPCW-g</a>
« Last Edit: March 22, 2010, 11:40:31 am by Adam. »

mattyg35

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Re: The Squat Thread
« Reply #38 on: March 22, 2010, 12:00:32 pm »
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Also, I tend to get hip pain when I go below parallel which has not been resolved by the repeated advice that it is a hip flexor length issue.

Where do you feel the pain?

Adam.

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Re: The Squat Thread
« Reply #39 on: March 22, 2010, 12:32:12 pm »
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When palpated, on the ASIS. During the squat when greater than 90 degrees hip flexion. Wider stance and knees out makes it worse. It seems to be a strain through the connective tissue of the sartorius since it originates in that location, but no one has really been able to diagnose that in particular.

The only thing I have read is that in some people the anterior portion of the greater trochanter can have nodules that press into the soft tissue during deep hip flexion. IDK, currently I'm doing trap bar deads as a way to get squats in without squatting, lol.

A more recent squat video. I bought a pair of oly shoes to get a narrower stance and hopefully stave off some of the hip issues. It seemed to work for a while, but they slowly came creeping back in.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rs779R-PwNc" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rs779R-PwNc</a>
« Last Edit: March 22, 2010, 02:20:05 pm by Adam. »

nba8340

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Re: The Squat Thread
« Reply #40 on: March 22, 2010, 02:48:56 pm »
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i had somethign real similar adam, i basically had an adhesion around the vmo/sartorius right above the knee and it was causing my knee pain

some ART and foam rolling should help, that's how mine got out.  I stil have other adhesions around that area, i think it's just a result of the quads/hip flexors being real tight and so when doing squats/etc going deep you the hamstrings are  really lengthened,, like too lengthened and at the same time contracting like crazy and adhesions start to form in the connective tisssue

Adam.

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Re: The Squat Thread
« Reply #41 on: March 22, 2010, 03:50:48 pm »
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Like I said above NBA, my hip flexor length is not an issue. I have had a PT when doing work on my ankle say that I have more mobility that normal population for hip extension. As for adhesions, maybe, but I don't think they explain why I get low grade pain during unloaded hip flexion.

adarqui

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Re: The Squat Thread
« Reply #42 on: March 22, 2010, 04:37:32 pm »
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thanks vag.



tally sorted:

43.9    (Nightfly)
47       (jumper5000)
47,8    (rip)
49,4    (miles)
49,5    (raptor)
50,5    (vag)
50,7    (adarq)
50,75   (arowe)
50,75   (allstar)
51,14   (Volleybel)
51,3    (zgin)
51,39   (nba8340)
51,5    (tychver)
52       (nishan.a)
52,1    (kingfish)
54.1    (Adam)
55.2    (RJ)
55,9    (mattyg55)

adarqui

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Re: The Squat Thread
« Reply #43 on: March 22, 2010, 07:25:32 pm »
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nishan.a:
91/174 = 52 shr, age 18

squatting deep = very easy (i usually do a hip flexor static stretch first anyway though)

nba8340

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Re: The Squat Thread
« Reply #44 on: March 22, 2010, 08:33:15 pm »
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Like I said above NBA, my hip flexor length is not an issue. I have had a PT when doing work on my ankle say that I have more mobility that normal population for hip extension. As for adhesions, maybe, but I don't think they explain why I get low grade pain during unloaded hip flexion.

maybe not the hip flexor, maybe rectus femoris or other quad muscle?