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D4
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« on: July 10, 2011, 09:51:13 am » |
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So what I don't understand is, when I first started squatting, I did quarter/half type squats. I just went down until I felt my glutes burning up. During these squats, I would always be sore in my glutes the next day, no quad soreness. I switched the parallel squats, and now I feel the burn on each rep on my quads like crazy, but no glutes firing. The next day only slight quad soreness. Today, I continued my parallel squatting, but for some reason, I felt the burn on my quads AND MY HAMSTRINGS for the first time. What's going on here? Also, how come my glutes are NEVER sore now, even if I do dead lifts primarily focusing on using my lower body? I end up sore as hell in my hamstrings the next day when I dead lift but no glutes at all? |
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Goal is to dunk.
Vertical needed to dunk: 40"
Current vertical : 37"
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adarqui
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« Reply #1 on: July 15, 2011, 01:44:47 am » |
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So what I don't understand is, when I first started squatting, I did quarter/half type squats. I just went down until I felt my glutes burning up. During these squats, I would always be sore in my glutes the next day, no quad soreness.
quads weren't "stretched enough under tension" to get sore. I switched the parallel squats, and now I feel the burn on each rep on my quads like crazy, but no glutes firing. The next day only slight quad soreness.
ya the quads are contracting eccentrically through a greater range of motion.. weird about the glutes though, perhaps you are allowing your knees to travel forward a bit much instead of really pulling those femurs back as you descend. Today, I continued my parallel squatting, but for some reason, I felt the burn on my quads AND MY HAMSTRINGS for the first time.
quads/hams could still be a bit fatigued from the deep session? dno, i wouldn't imagine quads would be freaking out at parallel or higher if they hadn't before, sounds like they are still fatigued.. What's going on here?
fatigue from previous session probably. Also, how come my glutes are NEVER sore now, even if I do dead lifts primarily focusing on using my lower body? I end up sore as hell in my hamstrings the next day when I dead lift but no glutes at all?
well hamstrings get sore very easily, especially in such a lengthened position when deadlifting/rdl'n.. as for glutes, they probably have just become "too strong" given the movements you do.. glutes & quads are well adapted, hamstrings are suffering/weak link.. if you want to destroy your glutes, try barbell BSS, deep db or barbell walking lunges, or db single leg 'squat' (not pistols)... your glutes will start getting sore again for sure. pc |
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http://adarq.org/code/"Now Cornell University neurobiologists, studying the adrenal glands of rats, have discovered how chronic stress cranks up the intensity of this adrenaline response. The key to this so-called molecular memory resides in a donut-shaped protein on the surface of cells that secrete adrenaline, the hormone also known as epinephrine." PED's in drug free sports is cheating, unethical, and weak. Athletes and/or coaches who condone/display this behavior can get lost."But you have never felt the burn that you get in the hip flexors from pulling back on the pedal stroke, you have never done the exercise in your life. Squatting ain't doing shit for your hip flexors blu." -- sickenin vendetta. QuickMix: Gulf Dunk Mix: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PHyFdbJnrY&hd=1The Promise Dunk Mix: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ed5VRE0lOXU&hd=1Ballet Dunk Mix: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pI_c2dz0C_4&hd=1BoingTerd Dunk Session: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6mHaUoNpOg&hd=1Dunk Films: dunk=surfing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oAp_z9fVyMQMay 2011 Dunk Mix: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z7MYrl716-kMay13-2011 Nice dunk session: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=73BhhFenp7o&feature=player_embeddedAPRIL 2011 DUNK RECAP/MIX: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VuPS1Sm10dsSome hard freakin` dunks: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3nukAo_IizA , http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QU7URZQ3Y4U , http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMQo64DzV70WHO RUN IT DUNK MIX - PART 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xypWSL5YVEwadarq.org commercial #2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QBYlngDcxFY = if at first you don't succeed, AMP THE F UP & TRY AGAIN. lion swag dunk mix: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhyqcL4fO-gmisc dunk footage from 2/20/2011, gettin` up: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XhF8F43z5Ogend of 2010 dunk session: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2fwJ8e5Vs8The "I think i'm dying dunk mix" : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XiXkdX5QLNo
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steven-miller
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« Reply #2 on: July 15, 2011, 01:56:20 am » |
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Don't worry about NOT being sore. There is nothing wrong with not feeling pain in your muscles for days after a work-out. |
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D4
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« Reply #3 on: July 16, 2011, 02:58:37 pm » |
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Thanks guys, I'll just keep hitting those squats and dead lifts and just get stronger, without worrying too much about the soreness patterns changing. |
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Goal is to dunk.
Vertical needed to dunk: 40"
Current vertical : 37"
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D4
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« Reply #4 on: July 18, 2011, 12:08:41 pm » |
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Wait a minute, the thing about this is, not only are my glutes not getting sore, but I don't feel it in my glutes at all during my squats or trap bar dead lifts or conventional dead lifts lol. And I am doing the DL's in a lower body dominant way, using my hips, etc.. Also adarq, I try to do my squats sitting back as much as I can. Does this mean my glutes are not being worked out? I definitely feel it in my quads and hams on each rep, but don't feel shit on my glutes. |
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Goal is to dunk.
Vertical needed to dunk: 40"
Current vertical : 37"
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LanceSTS
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« Reply #5 on: July 18, 2011, 12:13:51 pm » |
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Wait a minute, the thing about this is, not only are my glutes not getting sore, but I don't feel it in my glutes at all during my squats or trap bar dead lifts or conventional dead lifts lol. And I am doing the DL's in a lower body dominant way, using my hips, etc..
Also adarq, I try to do my squats sitting back as much as I can.
Does this mean my glutes are not being worked out? I definitely feel it in my quads and hams on each rep, but don't feel shit on my glutes.
If youre sitting back and not getting the glutes engaged, youre probably over arching the low back, putting more stress on the hams and less on the glutes. Video of your squat would be the easiest way to tell. |
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Relax.
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mattyg35
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« Reply #7 on: July 19, 2011, 05:54:24 pm » |
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I like doing bodyweight, bouncy-type squats before training, get warmed up, get the stretch reflex going, also a little bit of a pump if you do enough reps. |
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mj
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« Reply #8 on: July 19, 2011, 11:46:05 pm » |
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Wait a minute, the thing about this is, not only are my glutes not getting sore, but I don't feel it in my glutes at all during my squats or trap bar dead lifts or conventional dead lifts lol. And I am doing the DL's in a lower body dominant way, using my hips, etc..
Also adarq, I try to do my squats sitting back as much as I can.
Does this mean my glutes are not being worked out? I definitely feel it in my quads and hams on each rep, but don't feel shit on my glutes.
If youre sitting back and not getting the glutes engaged, youre probably over arching the low back, putting more stress on the hams and less on the glutes. Video of your squat would be the easiest way to tell. If someone has an exaggerated lordodic curve could this be a recurring problem, engaging the glutes I mean? I've always had trouble activating the glutes on all the big lifts like old mate above and have a bit of an exaggerated curve happening. I remember after squatting for about 6 months I got accidentally hit a groove on one rep where my glutes really fired. Surprised the hell out of me! Tried all the stretching etc but can't seem to get rid of it. I only get really good glute input when my torso is bolt upright, which it can't be in squats cause I have looong femurs. Pretty frustrating. I end up turning to hip thrusts etc to feel the glutes work but this is a band aid fix. Sorry 4 the hijack. |
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LanceSTS
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« Reply #9 on: July 20, 2011, 12:35:08 am » |
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Wait a minute, the thing about this is, not only are my glutes not getting sore, but I don't feel it in my glutes at all during my squats or trap bar dead lifts or conventional dead lifts lol. And I am doing the DL's in a lower body dominant way, using my hips, etc..
Also adarq, I try to do my squats sitting back as much as I can.
Does this mean my glutes are not being worked out? I definitely feel it in my quads and hams on each rep, but don't feel shit on my glutes.
If youre sitting back and not getting the glutes engaged, youre probably over arching the low back, putting more stress on the hams and less on the glutes. Video of your squat would be the easiest way to tell. If someone has an exaggerated lordodic curve could this be a recurring problem, engaging the glutes I mean? I've always had trouble activating the glutes on all the big lifts like old mate above and have a bit of an exaggerated curve happening. I remember after squatting for about 6 months I got accidentally hit a groove on one rep where my glutes really fired. Surprised the hell out of me! Tried all the stretching etc but can't seem to get rid of it. I only get really good glute input when my torso is bolt upright, which it can't be in squats cause I have looong femurs. Pretty frustrating. I end up turning to hip thrusts etc to feel the glutes work but this is a band aid fix. Sorry 4 the hijack. yea that groove you hit was just likely closer to "neutral", and put the pelvis in a more optimal position for the glutes to fire. One thing ive found that helps people in your situation is to actually contract the abdominals isometrically, but not allow the trunk to flex. It sounds strange but if you try it you can understand the position better. The contraction will keep an already exaggerated curve from being as big of a factor, and help you attain a slightly less "bowed" position in your lifts. This is one of the reasons its easier for most people to feel the glutes working during exercises like zercher squats vs traditional. one thing that really helps is to use pauses at different spots in the lifts, for example pause briefly and hold at the bottom of the squat until you "feel" the glutes firing hard. Practice keeping the abdominals "tensed" without allowing the spine to flex and see if that doesnt solve your issue. |
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Relax.
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Raptor
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« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2011, 03:17:15 am » |
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Wait a minute, the thing about this is, not only are my glutes not getting sore, but I don't feel it in my glutes at all during my squats or trap bar dead lifts or conventional dead lifts lol. And I am doing the DL's in a lower body dominant way, using my hips, etc..
Also adarq, I try to do my squats sitting back as much as I can.
Does this mean my glutes are not being worked out? I definitely feel it in my quads and hams on each rep, but don't feel shit on my glutes.
If youre sitting back and not getting the glutes engaged, youre probably over arching the low back, putting more stress on the hams and less on the glutes. Video of your squat would be the easiest way to tell. If someone has an exaggerated lordodic curve could this be a recurring problem, engaging the glutes I mean? I've always had trouble activating the glutes on all the big lifts like old mate above and have a bit of an exaggerated curve happening. I remember after squatting for about 6 months I got accidentally hit a groove on one rep where my glutes really fired. Surprised the hell out of me! Tried all the stretching etc but can't seem to get rid of it. I only get really good glute input when my torso is bolt upright, which it can't be in squats cause I have looong femurs. Pretty frustrating. I end up turning to hip thrusts etc to feel the glutes work but this is a band aid fix. Sorry 4 the hijack. yea that groove you hit was just likely closer to "neutral", and put the pelvis in a more optimal position for the glutes to fire. One thing ive found that helps people in your situation is to actually contract the abdominals isometrically, but not allow the trunk to flex. It sounds strange but if you try it you can understand the position better. The contraction will keep an already exaggerated curve from being as big of a factor, and help you attain a slightly less "bowed" position in your lifts. This is one of the reasons its easier for most people to feel the glutes working during exercises like zercher squats vs traditional. one thing that really helps is to use pauses at different spots in the lifts, for example pause briefly and hold at the bottom of the squat until you "feel" the glutes firing hard. Practice keeping the abdominals "tensed" without allowing the spine to flex and see if that doesnt solve your issue. Wonder what happens if he does 1&1/2 squats. Strangely enough, for me, I had a great glute soreness the first time I did half squats. Interesting. |
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LanceSTS
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« Reply #11 on: July 20, 2011, 06:15:22 am » |
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Wait a minute, the thing about this is, not only are my glutes not getting sore, but I don't feel it in my glutes at all during my squats or trap bar dead lifts or conventional dead lifts lol. And I am doing the DL's in a lower body dominant way, using my hips, etc..
Also adarq, I try to do my squats sitting back as much as I can.
Does this mean my glutes are not being worked out? I definitely feel it in my quads and hams on each rep, but don't feel shit on my glutes.
If youre sitting back and not getting the glutes engaged, youre probably over arching the low back, putting more stress on the hams and less on the glutes. Video of your squat would be the easiest way to tell. If someone has an exaggerated lordodic curve could this be a recurring problem, engaging the glutes I mean? I've always had trouble activating the glutes on all the big lifts like old mate above and have a bit of an exaggerated curve happening. I remember after squatting for about 6 months I got accidentally hit a groove on one rep where my glutes really fired. Surprised the hell out of me! Tried all the stretching etc but can't seem to get rid of it. I only get really good glute input when my torso is bolt upright, which it can't be in squats cause I have looong femurs. Pretty frustrating. I end up turning to hip thrusts etc to feel the glutes work but this is a band aid fix. Sorry 4 the hijack. yea that groove you hit was just likely closer to "neutral", and put the pelvis in a more optimal position for the glutes to fire. One thing ive found that helps people in your situation is to actually contract the abdominals isometrically, but not allow the trunk to flex. It sounds strange but if you try it you can understand the position better. The contraction will keep an already exaggerated curve from being as big of a factor, and help you attain a slightly less "bowed" position in your lifts. This is one of the reasons its easier for most people to feel the glutes working during exercises like zercher squats vs traditional. one thing that really helps is to use pauses at different spots in the lifts, for example pause briefly and hold at the bottom of the squat until you "feel" the glutes firing hard. Practice keeping the abdominals "tensed" without allowing the spine to flex and see if that doesnt solve your issue. Wonder what happens if he does 1&1/2 squats. Strangely enough, for me, I had a great glute soreness the first time I did half squats. Interesting. well assuming you break at the hips first during a squat, what is the first half of a squat doing? youre sitting the hips back so youre really putting the glutes into a position to fire assuming you dont just push the knees forward. If you are talking about your "narrow stance" half squats, what COULD have happened was, the soreness was the glute med area over stretching, which will lead to injury alot of times when people with wider hips attempt to squat too narrow. Draw a wider set of hips, then draw the femurs pointing inward to the ground, once you start squatting down, the stretch on the outer portion of the hips gets higher and higher in a very disadvantageous position to the body. Im not saying that is what happened, Im just saying that its not un common to see those type of injuries happen from guys trying to squat with a stance too close, especially if they have wider hips. |
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Relax.
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Raptor
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« Reply #12 on: July 20, 2011, 08:34:16 am » |
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Nah, I have narrow hips. Probably a good reason why I jump well off one leg. But doing bilateral jumping I'm usually VERY quad dominant (heck, jumping rope I jump it using the quads and bending the knees and pulling my knees to the chest and all that... well nevermind  ) so it was interesting to feel glute soreness (don't think it was glute med, not sure though, it felt in the entire butt). |
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Alex V
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« Reply #13 on: July 20, 2011, 10:23:54 am » |
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As stated befor you are probably dropping out of neutral into lordosis. Most likely the low abs are giving out as you get lower. Low ab work (non-tripod) coupled with squatting just until you lose glute function (ie they turn off) and coming up should lead to better glute recruitment over time. Also dont get obsessed about parallel. Only go as low as you can properly. Over time you should be able to get deeper and deeper. |
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steven-miller
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« Reply #14 on: July 20, 2011, 11:36:25 am » |
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Also dont get obsessed about parallel. Only go as low as you can properly. Over time you should be able to get deeper and deeper.
Alex, I have never understood why you would recommend that to a guy, especially a beginner, over the internet. I can to a degree understand why in group coaching situations with team sport athletes you might not have the time to coach a full squat to everyone. But this person is trying to learn full squats, because they are a better exercise for a beginner, and needs to be introduced to correct form as long as the weights are light. I doubt that doing it wrong now will make it easier to do it correct later. In the process of doing squats high nothing is learned that helps doing squats low later, since in most cases technical problems are the reason for the inability of reaching good depth with reasonable form. |
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