Author Topic: Hindu and Quarter Hindu Squats: Get Those Knees WAAAAY Out Over Toes  (Read 2167 times)

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Gary

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I took the advice to keep my shins near-vertical in most of my squatting. I wasn't playing any sports (just powerlifting) and over time I've discovered that I've lost strength in my knees in the knees-over-toes position. This is the position the knees assume when braking a quick run or descending into a powerful jump.

I've started doing higher bar squats which get the knees out a little farther over the toes, as well as some occasional front squats. They've helped, but I've still been feeling very unstable in the knees forward position.

Lately I've adopted daily bodyweight Hindu squats so my knees could get some strength in that position, but recently I discovered that quarter/half Hindu squats are even better. This is the position that PTs have been trendily warning people from getting into. But if you don't use it, you'll lose it. I'm regaining strength in that position and my knees are feeling better.

To see what I mean, stand up straight. Rise up onto the balls of your feet and let your knees bend so that they go way forward of the toes. Keep the torso upright and descend just a few inches so that your torso remains upright and you end up well above a parallel squat.

I'd lost the ability to maintain that position at all. I'm reacquiring it now. I do high rep bodyweight-only sets of Hindu squats to the full and half positions. I will hold both every few reps or so.

It's sad that the trend for the past few years has been to treat knees-forward as unnatural and even dangerous. I trace it to one style of squatting suited to multi-ply geared powerlifting becoming enormously popular. We've been pretending that quads aren't that important for athletic movement and that athletes never have their knees way in front of their toes on the field. But being strong in the knees forward position isn't just the prerogative of athletes; it's a basic trait of healthy knees. Being able to good-morning squat several hundred pounds while being too weak in the knees to squat with knees forward screams of imbalance.
Height: 5'9.5"
Wingspan: 6'4"
Standing Reach Barefoot: 7'10"
Weight: 175 lbs
Standing Vertical Jump: 29"
Running Vertical Jump Bilateral: 30.5"
Running Vertical Jump, Unilateral: 25"
Standing Broad Jump: 9'3"
Beltless High Bar Squat: 365
Beltless Conventional Deadlift: 450
Low Bar Squat w/ Belt (in USAPL raw): 418
Sumo Deadlift w/ Belt (in USAPL raw): 506

Daballa100

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Re: Hindu and Quarter Hindu Squats: Get Those Knees WAAAAY Out Over Toes
« Reply #1 on: June 20, 2011, 02:17:08 pm »
+1
Yeah, I was tricked by those westside/elitefts guys thinking the posterior chain was so much more important.  I gained 2 inches in 10 months on my DLRVJ doing box squats.  WTF, I went from 25 inches to 27, big whoop.  I switched my box squats to olympic style squats, because I read all of adarqui's posts on why quads were just as important as PC.  I also put in more ankle assistance work like stiff leg ankle hops, and more calf raises.  In less than 2 weeks, I went from a 27 inch DLRVJ, to a 29 inch DROPSTEP vertical.  The test was today, wasn't even warmed up or psyched, I was just shooting around getting some skill work in and decided to pop by the rim. 

Can't wait to try some half squats after I'm through this strength/hypertrophy block :P

Raptor

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Re: Hindu and Quarter Hindu Squats: Get Those Knees WAAAAY Out Over Toes
« Reply #2 on: June 20, 2011, 07:03:20 pm »
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Interesting. :strong:

TKXII

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Re: Hindu and Quarter Hindu Squats: Get Those Knees WAAAAY Out Over Toes
« Reply #3 on: August 26, 2011, 11:33:42 pm »
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I also questioned this myth, don't get your knees out in front of your toes.. why would it hurt? Running on a treadmill ir probably worse.

Front squats with feet together has been my jam. At the bottom of the squat I'm still on mid foot, never the heels during a front squat, it just doesn't feel right.
"Performance during stretch-shortening cycle exercise is influenced by the visco-elastic properties of the muscle-tendon units. During stretching of an activated muscle, mechanical energy is absorbed in the tendon structures (tendon and aponeurosis) and this energy can subsequently be re-utilized if shortening of the muscle immediately follows the stretching. According to Biscotti (2000), 72% of the elastic energy restitution action comes from tendons, 28% - from contractile elements of muscles.

http://www.verkhoshansky.com/Portals/0/Presentations/Shock%20Method%20Plyometrics.pdf