Author Topic: Stretch to Win  (Read 6113 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

LBSS

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12841
  • plugging away...
  • Respect: +7949
    • View Profile
    • Email
Stretch to Win
« on: September 24, 2010, 11:34:49 am »
0
Stretch to Win (http://www.amazon.com/Stretch-Win-Ann-Frederick/dp/0736055290) is an excellent book. Its purpose is to lay out the foundations of the authors' methodology and then describe how to apply those principles for personal use. The principles are described first. Then there is a quick, well-written anatomy lesson that goes into basics about different types of fascia and muscle tissue and how they respond to stress (whether it be good or bad). Then the authors describe a self-evaluation that the reader is supposed to undertake before proceeding with the last part of the book. That's all laid out very clearly, with each step broken down and some helpful cues given. After that the authors give detailed descriptions of each layer of stretching, from the core stretches (which I'm doing now), down the chain of to sport-specific stretches.

Couple of interesting takeaways:
1) Stretching to a count (10 seconds, 20 seconds, whatever) is dumb. Your muscle doesn't know what a second is so setting an arbitrary length of time makes no sense. It's better to cycle stretching with your breath, pushing a little bit with the exhalations and relaxing with the inhalations, until you feel the muscle release some of its tension.
2) It's important to stretch the core (hips) first before moving to the extremities, and to stretch muscles/tissues that just cross one joint before moving to multi-joint muscles/tissues.

Couple of downsides:
1) This isn't really a fault of the book, because I can't imagine how you would describe it in writing, but I've had a hard time knowing when to stop a particular stretch, i.e. when the muscle has "released its tension." But this may simply be a result of my muscles being super, super tight!
2) The stretch descriptions are generally adequate to very good, but a couple of the ones I've followed so far either aren't explicit enough or I'm too dumb to understand what to do.

On the whole, though, a really, really worthwhile book. I'm looking forward to incorporating a little bit of sense into my stretching and seeing how my flexibility, posture, performance, etc. improve. And for $13.57 on Amazon, the price is right.

One last thing: A lot of fitness-industry products will get "testimonials" from "pro athletes." These tend to be minor-league types, or obscure Pan Am games qualifiers or whatever. And often, the athlete met the product-seller one time, or they had a phone consult, and the product-seller tries to say that the athlete is a client, or a friend, or whatever. The athletes giving testimonials for Stretch to Win are legit high-level pros, and they're obviously really clients. Donovan McNabb is the model for some of the stretches at the end of the book and you know these people don't have enough cash lying around to afford McNabb's endorsement rates. Anyway, testimonials only mean so much, but these are still impressive. Eric Cressey may train some minor-leaguers and may have spent some time with Curt Schilling after he retired, but Ann and Chris Frederick work extensively with elite-level pros at the peak of their careers. Think Al Vermeil or Dan Pfaff. These people obviously know their shit.
Muscles are nonsensical they have nothing to do with this bullshit.

- Avishek

https://www.savannahstate.edu/cost/nrotc/documents/Inform2010-thearmstrongworkout_Enclosure15_5-2-10.pdf

black lives matter

JackW

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 184
  • Respect: +16
    • View Profile
    • VerticalJumping.com
Re: Stretch to Win
« Reply #1 on: September 28, 2010, 01:59:16 am »
0
Just ordered a copy now.  Nice write up.

adarqui

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 34034
  • who run it.
  • Respect: +9110
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Stretch to Win
« Reply #2 on: September 28, 2010, 03:52:04 pm »
0
Stretch to Win (http://www.amazon.com/Stretch-Win-Ann-Frederick/dp/0736055290) is an excellent book. Its purpose is to lay out the foundations of the authors' methodology and then describe how to apply those principles for personal use. The principles are described first. Then there is a quick, well-written anatomy lesson that goes into basics about different types of fascia and muscle tissue and how they respond to stress (whether it be good or bad). Then the authors describe a self-evaluation that the reader is supposed to undertake before proceeding with the last part of the book. That's all laid out very clearly, with each step broken down and some helpful cues given. After that the authors give detailed descriptions of each layer of stretching, from the core stretches (which I'm doing now), down the chain of to sport-specific stretches.

Couple of interesting takeaways:
1) Stretching to a count (10 seconds, 20 seconds, whatever) is dumb. Your muscle doesn't know what a second is so setting an arbitrary length of time makes no sense. It's better to cycle stretching with your breath, pushing a little bit with the exhalations and relaxing with the inhalations, until you feel the muscle release some of its tension.
2) It's important to stretch the core (hips) first before moving to the extremities, and to stretch muscles/tissues that just cross one joint before moving to multi-joint muscles/tissues.

Couple of downsides:
1) This isn't really a fault of the book, because I can't imagine how you would describe it in writing, but I've had a hard time knowing when to stop a particular stretch, i.e. when the muscle has "released its tension." But this may simply be a result of my muscles being super, super tight!
2) The stretch descriptions are generally adequate to very good, but a couple of the ones I've followed so far either aren't explicit enough or I'm too dumb to understand what to do.

On the whole, though, a really, really worthwhile book. I'm looking forward to incorporating a little bit of sense into my stretching and seeing how my flexibility, posture, performance, etc. improve. And for $13.57 on Amazon, the price is right.

One last thing: A lot of fitness-industry products will get "testimonials" from "pro athletes." These tend to be minor-league types, or obscure Pan Am games qualifiers or whatever. And often, the athlete met the product-seller one time, or they had a phone consult, and the product-seller tries to say that the athlete is a client, or a friend, or whatever. The athletes giving testimonials for Stretch to Win are legit high-level pros, and they're obviously really clients. Donovan McNabb is the model for some of the stretches at the end of the book and you know these people don't have enough cash lying around to afford McNabb's endorsement rates. Anyway, testimonials only mean so much, but these are still impressive. Eric Cressey may train some minor-leaguers and may have spent some time with Curt Schilling after he retired, but Ann and Chris Frederick work extensively with elite-level pros at the peak of their careers. Think Al Vermeil or Dan Pfaff. These people obviously know their shit.

nice writeup mang..

i stretch that way, trying to relax my breathes and holding a position for who knows how long, sometimes minutes at a time actually.. i just let the muscle turn to jello as i'm in the stretching, easing into a deeper stretch.. i don't really like stretching my quads though, seems to bug my knees/patella.. hamstrings/calfs/lats/rear delt/triceps/chest/adductors seem to be all i stretch.. quads/hip flexor/back/glutes react badly.

LBSS

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12841
  • plugging away...
  • Respect: +7949
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Stretch to Win
« Reply #3 on: September 28, 2010, 04:01:09 pm »
0
Maybe you're doing it wrong, then? Or if not "wrong" then at least there's another way that you're not seeing? IDK, I feel like, barring some actual physical problem, you should be able to stretch everything without pain.
Muscles are nonsensical they have nothing to do with this bullshit.

- Avishek

https://www.savannahstate.edu/cost/nrotc/documents/Inform2010-thearmstrongworkout_Enclosure15_5-2-10.pdf

black lives matter

adarqui

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 34034
  • who run it.
  • Respect: +9110
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Stretch to Win
« Reply #4 on: September 28, 2010, 04:12:28 pm »
0
Maybe you're doing it wrong, then? Or if not "wrong" then at least there's another way that you're not seeing? IDK, I feel like, barring some actual physical problem, you should be able to stretch everything without pain.

dno, stretching my quads leaves them weak for an entire day or so, then they get hurt doing jumps/movements etc.. actual stretching of them can aggravate the patella tendon also, perhaps it has something to do with my osgoodslotters or whatever, when i was growing up..

my hip flexors are chronically shortened, due to a very fast growth spurt, there's really nothing that can be done to help them other than leaving them alone.. stretching them really causes alot of aches.

peace

LanceSTS

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2255
  • Respect: +550
    • View Profile
    • http://www.youtube.com/user/LanceSTS
    • Email
Re: Stretch to Win
« Reply #5 on: September 29, 2010, 12:45:45 am »
0
 I have felt that same issue with the knee and seen it alot before, especially with athletes who have had knee surgeries, try flexing the glute on the same side as the quad youre stretching, it takes the pressure off the knee and deeper into the mid/upper quad, also if youre not already, hold higher on the ankle or put the ankle higher on whatever object you use to stretch, same thing, takes pressure of the knee and stretches deeper and further up the quads.  This is assuming you may not have already tried this, if you have and it still bothers your knee then yea, I would leave the stretch alone.
Relax.

bball2020

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 644
  • Respect: +66
    • View Profile
Re: Stretch to Win
« Reply #6 on: November 13, 2010, 02:15:45 pm »
0
LBSS, you hear about this book through defranco? He often remarks how all the stretching techniques he learned were from the Fredricks.

Adarq, have you ever tried the rectoris femoris/psoas stretch kelly baggett recommends?

adarqui

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 34034
  • who run it.
  • Respect: +9110
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Stretch to Win
« Reply #7 on: November 13, 2010, 03:02:39 pm »
0
LBSS, you hear about this book through defranco? He often remarks how all the stretching techniques he learned were from the Fredricks.

Adarq, have you ever tried the rectoris femoris/psoas stretch kelly baggett recommends?

this? <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_hQSJVIN3c" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_hQSJVIN3c</a>

nope.

i've done something on a bed, kinda similar, but i havn't been stretching alot lately.

pc

bball2020

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 644
  • Respect: +66
    • View Profile
Re: Stretch to Win
« Reply #8 on: November 13, 2010, 04:42:53 pm »
0
are u very quad tight? I bet u are or used to be. Can you easily pull your heel to your butt?

adarqui

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 34034
  • who run it.
  • Respect: +9110
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Stretch to Win
« Reply #9 on: November 13, 2010, 07:28:06 pm »
0
are u very quad tight? I bet u are or used to be. Can you easily pull your heel to your butt?

I can easily get heel to butt if i get very warmed up and just progress my stretching gradually over 5+ sets.. only sometimes i've been able to do that cold, but that's rare.

i wouldn't say my quads are tight though.. the tighter they are, the better I jump usually.. on that note, the looser my hamstrings, the better I jump usually..

for me, this is most often the case: calfs/quads tight = good, hamstrings loose = good.

pc

bball2020

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 644
  • Respect: +66
    • View Profile
Re: Stretch to Win
« Reply #10 on: November 13, 2010, 08:44:02 pm »
0
IC, didnt kelly say somewhere, i forget where, that almost every great/above average speed/strength athlete he trained could easily put his heel to butt?

anyways, one of my favorite stretches, feel so much better after doing it.

adarqui

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 34034
  • who run it.
  • Respect: +9110
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Stretch to Win
« Reply #11 on: November 14, 2010, 02:13:04 am »
0
IC, didnt kelly say somewhere, i forget where, that almost every great/above average speed/strength athlete he trained could easily put his heel to butt?

anyways, one of my favorite stretches, feel so much better after doing it.

not sure, i've seen plenty of ridiculously powerful athletes who were very tight (when i assisted in nfl combine training in 2006-2007 or whenever it was). There were also plenty who were very flexible.. many ways to skin a cat, really.

Deon sanders is one who people said was very tight, and the s&c coaches at FAU worked primarily on flexibility to get him faster, and it actually reduced his 40 time from 4.2x to 4.3-4.4x or some shit, I forget where I read it or heard it from so don't take it too seriously.. sometimes messing too much with an athletes flexibility can be detrimental.

I personally know, that if my quads feel overly loose/flexible, my plants/jumping feel very crappy.. speed feels good though.

I'm always for stretching after training, i'm just not big on achieving certain ROMs to be on par with someone elses flexibility, such as some elite athlete who has really impressive flexibility etc.. Stretching after training is essential, but it doesn't have to be taken to extremes. Small changes in ROM are usually beneficial, large changes in ROM (from my experience) are usually detrimental.

pc

LBSS

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12841
  • plugging away...
  • Respect: +7949
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Stretch to Win
« Reply #12 on: November 14, 2010, 05:50:30 pm »
0
LBSS, you hear about this book through defranco? He often remarks how all the stretching techniques he learned were from the Fredricks.

Adarq, have you ever tried the rectoris femoris/psoas stretch kelly baggett recommends?

Nah, saw it recommended on Lyle's forum. Probably by Lyle, actually, now that I think about it. But if Lyle likes it and DeFranco likes it, you can be pretty sure it's a badass book.
Muscles are nonsensical they have nothing to do with this bullshit.

- Avishek

https://www.savannahstate.edu/cost/nrotc/documents/Inform2010-thearmstrongworkout_Enclosure15_5-2-10.pdf

black lives matter

DamienZ

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 991
  • Yeah dude!
  • Respect: +47
    • View Profile
Re: Stretch to Win
« Reply #13 on: November 26, 2010, 06:26:16 pm »
0
i got that book about a year ago and its still the best book about flexibility that ive read!
Kurz and some (supposed to be good) german books by far arent as detailed as Stretch To Win. They also mention the connection of fascia and different fascial lines and how a problem somewhere can affect some other place on that fascial line.

Actually DeFranco is a certified Stretch To Win Trainer. You can see him use the special bench with straps to stretch in the DeFrancos Training Compilation.