Author Topic: What should be my strategy?  (Read 11860 times)

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Raptor

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What should be my strategy?
« on: November 07, 2010, 10:45:48 am »
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I'm trying to gain strength right now for the next 3-4 months. I'm at ~84 kg right now. Bodyfat % is probably ~15-16%.

What should be my approach in these 3-4 months in terms of eating? Should I eat like a bull everyday regardless if I go to the gym/I consume calories that day or should I just eat a lot in the training days/after training and keep a low calorie, low carb intake in my rest days?

Should I take a protein shake that's 50% protein 50% carbs after my training/in my training days instead of the 90% protein one that I'm taking right now?

Do you think I should aim at re-composition in this 3-4 month period (meaning - trying to build muscle in my training days in terms of nutrition and lose fat in the off days, maybe doing some running, cardio etc)? Or should I go all out into muscle building and forget about cardio and stuff, with the idea of shedding fat later?

adarqui

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Re: What should be my strategy?
« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2010, 05:39:44 pm »
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I'm trying to gain strength right now for the next 3-4 months. I'm at ~84 kg right now. Bodyfat % is probably ~15-16%.

What should be my approach in these 3-4 months in terms of eating? Should I eat like a bull everyday regardless if I go to the gym/I consume calories that day or should I just eat a lot in the training days/after training and keep a low calorie, low carb intake in my rest days?

eat one big meal on rest days, the rest of your meals should be low carb high + mod/high protein + moderate fat snacks.. on training days, same thing, but consume more in the meal after training (which is after he post workout shake).. so basically two big meals on training days.


Quote
Should I take a protein shake that's 50% protein 50% carbs after my training/in my training days instead of the 90% protein one that I'm taking right now?

wouldn't worry too much about that, but i'd lean more towards the 50/50 split, you'd want more carbs than 10% thats for sure.


Quote
Do you think I should aim at re-composition in this 3-4 month period (meaning - trying to build muscle in my training days in terms of nutrition and lose fat in the off days, maybe doing some running, cardio etc)? Or should I go all out into muscle building and forget about cardio and stuff, with the idea of shedding fat later?

definitely do the cardio, i'd say your focus is more on putting on MOSTLY lean mass with minimal fat, rather than losing fat & gaining muscle.. so, putting on mostly lean mass will have your body composition improving, and you'll have less fat to 'cut' when you reach your goals 3-4 months from now.. cleaning up your diet so it's less frequently carb heavy & getting in the cardio will help you achieve this.

so, on your rest days, for your snacks, you want something that is low carb + high protein + moderate fat... such as 2% milk + protein.. i imagine you will have a "blood thirst" kind of feeling once you start eating like this, and that's a bad sign.. once you are satisfied with a lower carb snack like that throughout the day, you'll be seeing some major physique changes. You could obviously use something else too, such as green veggies + small chicken breast or a sandwhich or something like that.. the point here is, eat most of your carbs in one meal, then eat them in much lesser amounts throughout the day.

avoid stuffing your face all day :P

peace

Tam

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Re: What should be my strategy?
« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2010, 05:54:52 pm »
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Quote
definitely do the cardio, i'd say your focus is more on putting on MOSTLY lean mass with minimal fat, rather than losing fat & gaining muscle.. so, putting on mostly lean mass will have your body composition improving, and you'll have less fat to 'cut' when you reach your goals 3-4 months from now.. cleaning up your diet so it's less frequently carb heavy & getting in the cardio will help you achieve this.

x2

I went down the route of eating big and lifting bid without any cardio. Although my strength and muscle size gains where great, i am paying for it now and its took so much longer to lose the fat than expected and not too mention that dieting is pretty horrible especially when you have a lot of fat to lose.

Carb cycling would be pretty good to increase strength/size without gaining too much fat. So maybe have 2-3 high carb days, 2-3 moderate and 2 low days. Maybe doing some Steady state cardio in the mornings, like 30-40 mins walking 3mph, should keep fat in check.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2010, 06:05:31 pm by Tam »

Raptor

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Re: What should be my strategy?
« Reply #3 on: November 08, 2010, 04:32:51 am »
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Is powder milk acceptable? Because I have milk intolerance... I mean, I can drink a cup or so per day but that's pretty much it.

I have a hard time of getting protein+fat meals. I mean, I have no idea of what these meals look like... I guess I always ate protein+carbs...

Can someone throw a few examples at me (I'll look for some in Kelly's body comp basics book).

Also, running won't be an option when winter comes. Running on the treadmill could be and kettlebell swings for cardio work... although I don't like using the treadmill... I'm afraid of it (falling and all that).

And wouldn't it be detrimental to muscle building if I burned calories doing stuff like running and cardio? Wouldn't they contradict each other?...

Raptor

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Re: What should be my strategy?
« Reply #4 on: November 08, 2010, 04:42:38 am »
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i imagine you will have a "blood thirst" kind of feeling once you start eating like this, and that's a bad sign

What do you mean by that?

vag

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Re: What should be my strategy?
« Reply #5 on: November 08, 2010, 04:46:09 am »
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Is powder milk acceptable? Because I have milk intolerance... I mean, I can drink a cup or so per day but that's pretty much it.

I have a hard time of getting protein+fat meals. I mean, I have no idea of what these meals look like... I guess I always ate protein+carbs...

Can someone throw a few examples at me (I'll look for some in Kelly's body comp basics book).

Also, running won't be an option when winter comes. Running on the treadmill could be and kettlebell swings for cardio work... although I don't like using the treadmill... I'm afraid of it (falling and all that).

And wouldn't it be detrimental to muscle building if I burned calories doing stuff like running and cardio? Wouldn't they contradict each other?...

Yoghurt , tuna salad , chicken salad , salad with a ton of low-fat cheese ( not tasty , oh well... :D ).
There are some lactose-free milks also i think? ( no homo  :P )
Target training paces (min/km), calculated from 5K PR 22:49 :
Easy run : 5:48
Tempo run : 4:50
VO2-max run :4:21
Speed form run : 4:02

---

it's the biggest trick in the run game.. go slow to go fast. it doesn't make sense until it smacks you in the face and you're like ....... wtf?

Raptor

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Re: What should be my strategy?
« Reply #6 on: November 08, 2010, 05:23:50 am »
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No homo ":P". For what does that ":P" stand for :D

But anyway, I thought fish + salad = protein + carbs?...

And I looked at a yoghurt bottle and it was like 4 protein, 5 carbs and 3 fats... so more carbs than fats... wtf?

vag

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Re: What should be my strategy?
« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2010, 05:44:54 am »
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No homo ":P". For what does that ":P" stand for :D

But anyway, I thought fish + salad = protein + carbs?...

And I looked at a yoghurt bottle and it was like 4 protein, 5 carbs and 3 fats... so more carbs than fats... wtf?

 :P = just for fun.

salad = minimum carbs. You can't just eat row chicken or tuna , put it in a bowl of lettuce or iceberg or whatever green veggies with some olive oil/mustard/lemon and you have a delicious salad. Check out the nutritional facts of lettuce and then weigh how much you can eat in a salad and you will know what i mean, carbs are too little.

Full yoghurt is more fat & less protein , go for low fat yoghurt , 2% , most of them will have ~8gr protein for every 100g. Personally i buy them in 1kg packs , eat about 300g every time. Dont go for 0% , that 2% is usefull, there is some shit going on like fat-soluble proteins in dairy products , long story short = you need some fat in dairy products or else youre ruining them.

Bottom line , don't freak with carbs. When we talk about carbs we mean to avoid pizza , pasta , rice , bread etc... Those foods have like 65g carbs per 100g and you can easily consume 200-300g of them! Carbs that come from veggies , milk , youghurt , meat etc are not worth mentioning , they're too little!
Target training paces (min/km), calculated from 5K PR 22:49 :
Easy run : 5:48
Tempo run : 4:50
VO2-max run :4:21
Speed form run : 4:02

---

it's the biggest trick in the run game.. go slow to go fast. it doesn't make sense until it smacks you in the face and you're like ....... wtf?

Raptor

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Re: What should be my strategy?
« Reply #8 on: November 08, 2010, 07:14:56 am »
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Well that yoghurt had more carbs than fat... weird.

Would you think getting rice AFTER a workout would be cool? I plan on doing that today. Rice + chicken.

My problem is with meals outside of training... when I'm idle at work sitting on a chair for 7-8 hours...

Would something like yoghurt + fish (pangasius) work for a meal at work? (for a protein + fat meal) Other ideas for this?

ghettoracer

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Re: What should be my strategy?
« Reply #9 on: November 08, 2010, 09:48:27 am »
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Personally i buy them in 1kg packs , eat about 300g every time.

about how much calories is 300g of these low fat cheese?
current stats: age: 42 :: 5'11" (180cm) :: 180lbs (82kg) bf ~30% :: reach: 90" or 7'6" (230cm) :: wing span: 6" (183cm)
12 week goal(current): SQ 115kg(100), DL 130kg(110), BP 80kg(70), reduce weight to 75kg (165 lbs) and bf to ~25%
status: excellent cardio condition, new 5x5 program, 10' rim touch okay, RVJ ~30"
PR RVJ ~34" 10'5" touch @ age ~25 (worst was ~6" below rim when i was @ 190 lbs ~35% body fat ~23" RVJ in 2007-8

vag

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Re: What should be my strategy?
« Reply #10 on: November 08, 2010, 10:08:10 am »
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Personally i buy them in 1kg packs , eat about 300g every time.

about how much calories is 300g of these low fat cheese?

I was referring to yogurt.
It will vary from brand to brand but on average 100g of low-fat yogurt would have something like ~80kcals , 8gr protein , 2gr fat , who-the-fuck-cares-its-only-80kcals gr carbs  ;D
Target training paces (min/km), calculated from 5K PR 22:49 :
Easy run : 5:48
Tempo run : 4:50
VO2-max run :4:21
Speed form run : 4:02

---

it's the biggest trick in the run game.. go slow to go fast. it doesn't make sense until it smacks you in the face and you're like ....... wtf?

adarqui

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Re: What should be my strategy?
« Reply #11 on: November 08, 2010, 06:42:23 pm »
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Is powder milk acceptable? Because I have milk intolerance... I mean, I can drink a cup or so per day but that's pretty much it.

i would assume so, i never took powdered milk.

Quote
I have a hard time of getting protein+fat meals. I mean, I have no idea of what these meals look like... I guess I always ate protein+carbs...

Can someone throw a few examples at me (I'll look for some in Kelly's body comp basics book).

what vag said, plus:

a better way to look at this is, what do you like eating? what can you easily obtain, to eat? For example, if I was planning on putting on a ton of muscle, I would focus on things I enjoy eating: eggs, milk, meat (steak/hamburger), chicken , broccoli/carrots/spinach/olive oil, kidney beans, bananas, cottage cheese, and a supplement: whey protein (for shakes).. My diet would then pretty much only consist of that, with 1 cheat day per week.


Quote
Also, running won't be an option when winter comes. Running on the treadmill could be and kettlebell swings for cardio work...



Quote
although I don't like using the treadmill... I'm afraid of it (falling and all that).

*smack*, incorporate jump rope also



Quote
And wouldn't it be detrimental to muscle building if I burned calories doing stuff like running and cardio? Wouldn't they contradict each other?...

no because cardio isn't using muscle protein as fuel unless you're in a severely catabolic state.. cardio is focusing on blood sugar, glycogen, or fat... You need to make sure your protein intake is high & that you get enough time under tension to stimulate growth, which is what you will be getting with 3x8/3x5 split. You're not going to be putting in enough cardio to cause a dent anyway.

Raptor

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Re: What should be my strategy?
« Reply #12 on: November 09, 2010, 09:03:44 am »
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Well yeah... too many eggs aren't toxic or something?

In terms of cardio - that will burn calories... and I can barely take too many to aid in muscle growth already. That's my issue. And I've started to eat really clean these last few days and plan on continuing with that. Hopefully some recomposition will occur.
« Last Edit: November 09, 2010, 09:10:11 am by Raptor »

LBSS

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Re: What should be my strategy?
« Reply #13 on: November 09, 2010, 09:33:21 am »
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Well yeah... too many eggs aren't toxic or something?

In terms of cardio - that will burn calories... and I can barely take too many to aid in muscle growth already. That's my issue. And I've started to eat really clean these last few days and plan on continuing with that. Hopefully some recomposition will occur.

Two things:

1) Eggs will instantly put your body in a catabolic state. I'm talking as soon as you put them in your mouth, kiss your muscles goodbye. In other words, for fuck's sake, no, too many eggs are not toxic.

2) Light cardio will not burn very many calories, and can help recovery. Don't think intervals, think nice long walks, easy biking, easy rowing, elliptical, etc.
Muscles are nonsensical they have nothing to do with this bullshit.

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Raptor

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Re: What should be my strategy?
« Reply #14 on: November 09, 2010, 09:40:58 am »
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Well my mom and dad always keep on throwing this "eggs cause liver problems" at me all the time it's getting really annoying.

Probably if you're eating like 20/day.