Author Topic: Age vs VO2max  (Read 983291 times)

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Raptor

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Re: Age vs Vertical
« Reply #2565 on: February 20, 2015, 08:18:11 am »
0
Nicely done. At least you know it's a CNS thing, not a muscular limitation.

maxent

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Re: Age vs Vertical
« Reply #2566 on: February 20, 2015, 08:27:02 am »
+1
Good work Vag. Do another cycle now while you're on a roll.
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

LBSS

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Re: Age vs Vertical
« Reply #2567 on: February 20, 2015, 08:59:29 am »
0
Good work Vag. Do another cycle now while you're on a roll.

agree
Muscles are nonsensical they have nothing to do with this bullshit.

- Avishek

https://www.savannahstate.edu/cost/nrotc/documents/Inform2010-thearmstrongworkout_Enclosure15_5-2-10.pdf

black lives matter

vag

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Re: Age vs Vertical
« Reply #2568 on: February 20, 2015, 01:35:03 pm »
0
Thanks all for the props!

Nicely done. At least you know it's a CNS thing, not a muscular limitation.

Or is it the other way around? It is a muscular limitation that i can only override with excessive CNS stim?  :P

Good work Vag. Do another cycle now while you're on a roll.

agree

It is a good idea. The program itself declares it is designed to increase strength without hypertrophy, so it would fit well for my plan for spring ( start a cut, maintain -and-why-not-if-possible-increase- limit strength, become by far the most relatively-strong i have been in my life ).

But for starters i am leaving tomorrow for a week of skiing. Let's see in what condition the iso&endurance monstrosity will bring me!

:lololol:
Target training paces (min/km), calculated from 5K PR 22:49 :
Easy run : 5:48
Tempo run : 4:50
VO2-max run :4:21
Speed form run : 4:02

---

it's the biggest trick in the run game.. go slow to go fast. it doesn't make sense until it smacks you in the face and you're like ....... wtf?

LBSS

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Re: Age vs Vertical
« Reply #2569 on: February 20, 2015, 02:14:48 pm »
0
i'm going skiing for the first time in probably 10 years next weekend (feb 28). however sore you're gonna be, i promise i'll be sorer.  :P
Muscles are nonsensical they have nothing to do with this bullshit.

- Avishek

https://www.savannahstate.edu/cost/nrotc/documents/Inform2010-thearmstrongworkout_Enclosure15_5-2-10.pdf

black lives matter

Raptor

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Re: Age vs Vertical
« Reply #2570 on: February 20, 2015, 10:59:25 pm »
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Hm... no... it just means that your CNS has reserves in its output.

vag

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Re: Age vs Vertical
« Reply #2571 on: March 01, 2015, 01:42:12 pm »
0
Back.
Winter holidays were awesome as always.
Tons of skiing, the gps trackers gave an average of 35-40km clean downhill skiing per day ( +50km a day including the lifts distance ) for 6 straight days.
Legs were incredibly strong, by far the strongest skiing legs i ever had.  Consequently i also did the best ski i have done in my life.
I like the feeling. I think i want to make a turn to a more 'functional' training style for the rest of the training season, lots of physio activity, without quitting strength training of course, just feel like switching the #1 priority to actual sports&movements ( basketball, sprints, plyos ) and keep strength training as the background accessory. Like more MSEM and speed-strength stuff and less volume.
:lololol:
Target training paces (min/km), calculated from 5K PR 22:49 :
Easy run : 5:48
Tempo run : 4:50
VO2-max run :4:21
Speed form run : 4:02

---

it's the biggest trick in the run game.. go slow to go fast. it doesn't make sense until it smacks you in the face and you're like ....... wtf?

vag

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Re: Age vs Vertical
« Reply #2572 on: March 04, 2015, 04:33:28 am »
0
4 March 2015

Bodyweight@session : ~86kg
Soreness : none
Injuries/aches : none

HANG POWER CLEAN:
5@15kg
5@25kg
3@35kg
3@45kg
1@55kg
3@45kg
5@45kg
-Rusty, haven't done them for almost a month. Failed 2nd rep @55kg. But was able to do 3+5 sweet reps @45kg after that. Weird.

HIGH BAR FULL SQUAT:
5@20kg
5@40kg
5@60kg
5@80kg
3@100kg
-Nice.

BENCH PRESS:
5@20kg
5@30kg
5@40kg
5@50kg
5@60kg
3@70kg
-Nice.

DEAD HANG PULLUPS:
7@BW
6@BW
5@BW
-Nice.

STANDING CALF RAISE MACHINE:
20@BW+50kg
20@BW+50kg
20@BW+50kg
-Kept it easy on purpose.

Overall feeling rusty after not hitting the gym for almost 2 weeks, but happy with the numbers i got.
Target training paces (min/km), calculated from 5K PR 22:49 :
Easy run : 5:48
Tempo run : 4:50
VO2-max run :4:21
Speed form run : 4:02

---

it's the biggest trick in the run game.. go slow to go fast. it doesn't make sense until it smacks you in the face and you're like ....... wtf?

gukl

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Re: Age vs Vertical
« Reply #2573 on: March 04, 2015, 05:54:10 pm »
+2
Hey man, I'll try and give you my best answer to your question!

Im no expert and have only just started structuring my oly stuff properly myself but what you talk about sounds sensible.

Firstly how is your technique? If it's not upto scratch, I think sorting it out could add 10kg alone. It won't be perfect obviously, so throwing in some lighter technique work one day, maybe with some primer drills like tall cleans/muscle cleans/high hang etc would be a good idea. Then obviously if you want to increase your numbers pushing the bigger weights helps too.

How about something like

Day 1: hang cleans for 5 x 3, stay 'comfortably not missing any reps' maybe progressing to 6 x 2
Day 2: technique drills before you're normal lifting/v light reps in just for perfecting the 'skill'
Day 3: like you suggested something like working upto a heavy singles and doing back offs for like 5 sets of 2 perhaps progressing to back off singles with a heavier weight.

Obviously there's a million ways to program and don't take this as gospel, but I don't see why something like this wouldn't lead to at least a 10kg gain in a month or so.


With technique being so important do you have any vids? Apologies if I just haven't looked hard enough! Also if grip is a limiting factor with the hang clean, make sure you're hook gripping and using chalk!

vag

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Re: Age vs Vertical
« Reply #2574 on: March 05, 2015, 03:33:28 am »
0
Thanks, very useful comeback!
I am liking the 3 days setup ( technique- assistance - max ). I am using the hook grip already after you suggesting it to entropy a couple of months back, works good for me.
No chalk unfortunately, no dumping either, commercial gym , FML. But i don't have to worry about grip for now, as my HPC is too light. I am able to do ~10 reps at ~100kg RDL without straps, so dealing with 60-70kg for the cleans is easy.
As for technique, ah, who knows. Unfortunately I don't have any videos. I learned HPC with Lance here, still watching instructional videos and observing mine trying to find my weak links and fix them. Also since the only setup i used so far is ramping up 3s, I treated each and every session as a technique session with the low weight sets.
I've put some screenshots up though recently, here are the links:
http://www.adarq.org/progress-journals-experimental-routines/vag%27s-journal-age-vs-vertical/msg105612/#msg105612
http://www.adarq.org/progress-journals-experimental-routines/vag%27s-journal-age-vs-vertical/msg105793/#msg105793
:lololol:

Target training paces (min/km), calculated from 5K PR 22:49 :
Easy run : 5:48
Tempo run : 4:50
VO2-max run :4:21
Speed form run : 4:02

---

it's the biggest trick in the run game.. go slow to go fast. it doesn't make sense until it smacks you in the face and you're like ....... wtf?

gukl

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Re: Age vs Vertical
« Reply #2575 on: March 05, 2015, 04:39:30 am »
+1
from a quick look, it looks ok..you're getting the hip extension part that everyone seems to struggle with at first.

-your front rack position looks like it could do with a bit of flexibility work?
- how wide are you gripping the bar? if you're long armed/short torso like me, a wider grip may help. I find a narrow grip, even one like id use for a deadlift leads to my 'jumping point' being far too low, really zapping my power. so widening the grip lets me bring the weight closer to my hips before 'exploding'. i can't exactly tell from the shots but you do like kinda narrow

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/314805/DUNK%20PICS/2015_01_31_powerlean_20kg.jpg like on this one. if this is the start of you're second pull its probably a bit low and you may benefit from widening the grip so you can get more into this kind of position

https://spencergarnold.files.wordpress.com/2013/04/487599_10151447506850270_1318251373_n.jpg?w=300&h=300

in fact that article seems pretty good

https://spencergarnold.wordpress.com/2013/04/02/grip-width-in-the-clean/

'If your grip is too narrow, and especially if you have long arms, the bar is likely to hit too low on your quads when you transition into the second pull.  This horizontal application of force into the barbell will push the bar out away from your body thus making the clean harder and more inefficient.  The grip must allow the bar to make contact with your upper thigh in the standing position.'

hope this helps!
 

vag

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Re: Age vs Vertical
« Reply #2576 on: March 05, 2015, 08:47:40 am »
0
Yes, you are spot on, my body is very disproportional. 6' barefoot, 6'5'' wingspan. 40'' legs , 21'' femurs. Small torso, long arms and legs. Even when i use a snatch grip i can't get the bar in the hip crease, it will be mid-thigh. When i am standing, if i stretch my arm without bending at the waist, i can tough my fucking knee. You get the picture. The grip i use is rather narrow indeed, just inside the 'rough' part of the bar. I will widen it to see what happens. Will research some mobility stuff too, last time i tried front squatting i noticed a significant decrease compared to the past.
Thanks again!

PS : Of course you never heard me complain about my long arms when i managed to dunk 10' with just 33'' of RVJ. Humans, greedy motherfuckers!  :P
Target training paces (min/km), calculated from 5K PR 22:49 :
Easy run : 5:48
Tempo run : 4:50
VO2-max run :4:21
Speed form run : 4:02

---

it's the biggest trick in the run game.. go slow to go fast. it doesn't make sense until it smacks you in the face and you're like ....... wtf?

gukl

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Re: Age vs Vertical
« Reply #2577 on: March 05, 2015, 09:19:23 am »
0
Haha no problem man, in exactly the same build as you then by the sounds, short torso, 6' with a 8' reach/6'5-6 arm span!

vag

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Re: Age vs Vertical
« Reply #2578 on: March 05, 2015, 02:31:49 pm »
0
5 March 2015

Bodyweight@session : ???
Soreness : sore hamstrings(abductors?) , chest, lets, forearms, quads
Injuries/aches : none

1,5 hours full court basketball.
Legs were not there, meaning how they felt. Too stiff, in-explosive, no bounce. Good power in them though, just hard and slow to express.
Endurance was ok, could be better, could be worse.
Got this clean 10'6'' touch ( 31'' ) while fresh and then everybody wanted me to dunk. No one gets that high anyway so they wouldn't take my word that i need 2 more inches to land a dunk. Didn't even try, useless. Also tried the toddday method at some point that i went out as a sub to rest: 25'' SVJ , 29'' dropstep , 30'' 1-step , no improvements from 2 steps. Fair.
Target training paces (min/km), calculated from 5K PR 22:49 :
Easy run : 5:48
Tempo run : 4:50
VO2-max run :4:21
Speed form run : 4:02

---

it's the biggest trick in the run game.. go slow to go fast. it doesn't make sense until it smacks you in the face and you're like ....... wtf?

vag

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Re: Age vs Vertical
« Reply #2579 on: March 08, 2015, 03:02:02 pm »
0
7 March 2015

Bodyweight@session : ~86,5kg
Soreness : none
Injuries/aches : none

MUSCLE POWER CLEAN:
5@20kg
5@20kg
3@30kg
2@35kg
3@30kg ( full clean )
5@20kg ( full clean )
-Playing around to find optimum load for those. Looks like it is 30kg for something like 5x3.

FRONT SQUAT:
5@20kg
5@40kg
3@60kg
HIGH BAR FULL SQUAT:
20@60kg
-Tried getting back to front squat. Legs were very good, i love the front squats, but I have problems with rack position. Shoulder mobility is ok i think, i can do ATG front squats with my hands extended forward, bar sitting on shoulders, no problem. Looks like my forearm is too damn long (FML), causing an extreme wrist flex. I will try bodybuilding style front squats next time ( arms crossed ) to see what happens.
I am liking the high-rep finisher too. Gonna keep it. Or incorporate an MEBM session. Still trying to set a plan, will post it tomorrow.

BB OHP:
12@35kg
10@35kg

BENT OVER DB ROW:
15 each hand @ 30kg
12 each hand @ 30kg

Was short on time so did 2xF for OHP and BOR. Went well.
« Last Edit: March 08, 2015, 03:08:53 pm by vag »
Target training paces (min/km), calculated from 5K PR 22:49 :
Easy run : 5:48
Tempo run : 4:50
VO2-max run :4:21
Speed form run : 4:02

---

it's the biggest trick in the run game.. go slow to go fast. it doesn't make sense until it smacks you in the face and you're like ....... wtf?