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31
Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« Last post by LBSS on June 23, 2025, 05:10:19 pm »
damn it, the more i read about it, the more it seems like norwegian singles is where it's at. i don't see why it wouldn't work even for ultra training, since the point is to limit day-to-day fatigue and so there should still be space for progressively longer runs once a week. something like what joe is doing:

  • monday: 3x10min @MP
  • tuesday: medium/easy
  • wednesday: 5 x 6min @HMP (with the group but doing my own thing)
  • thursday: medium/easy
  • friday: 10 x 3min @15kP
  • saturday: weights
  • sunday: long/easy, as much as possible on trails

with warm up and cool down those workout days would be 10.5-11.5 km, medium days are already 10-11 and could gradually build up to 13-14 (that was the plan anyway) and long run could just keep building bit by bit toward 42 until the 50k at end of october. that would mean weekly mileage starting around 70kpw and going up to 100kpw, give or take. and do weights on one of the easy weekdays in addition to the saturday.

ultra people talk about the importance of back-to-back long days but i feel like if i build up to a full marathon long run before the 50k, race the 50k, and then taper down to the 50 miler, that should be plenty. finishing 50 miles just doesn't seem that daunting. and wouldn't getting up at 6 AM to do a 3x10 less than 24 hours after finishing a long run serve the same purpose, pretty much?

pros:
1. lots of running but with variety
2. many people reporting great fitness gains
3. would enable me to keep working on sub-ultra fitness while building long distance fitness

cons:
1. i'm getting too cute, progressing volume and one speed workout a week plus tempo sometimes on saturdays will build fitness, too.
2. i'm going to have a hard time sticking to a routine where i work out every day.
3. it is too fucking hot out.
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Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: warpspeed to the new scenario
« Last post by Joe on June 23, 2025, 03:44:46 pm »
23-06-25

Run -- 7.7k, 50:50

Notes

HR - 127. Back to reality with 6.45 pre-coffee outdoor runs.
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Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: Kingfush
« Last post by Kingfish on June 22, 2025, 10:45:21 pm »
Jun 22-28 , 2025

Full Squats - Paused - Maintenance
455 #275+ | 465 #5 | 470 #1| 475 #85 | 495#100+ | 505#2 | 545#1
Page 75 - Day 1 of 455. Feb 11, 2013
Page 140 - Day 1 of 495. 2Oct 25, 2020
Cardio Calories - Inclined walking at 3mph pace per 5 mins | 6% [47kcal], 9% [57kcal], 12%[67kcal], 15%[77kcal]

June Week 4 of 4 BW 206-210

Sun Jun 22

6:00 am
Paused Squats 315-315-315,405
Iso Hammer Strength Inclined Press Machine ~135 80-105-115 x5
One Arm Cable Reverse Fly - High/Mid Pull 15-20-25-30 x5
Seated Bicep Curl Machine - One Arm 50-60-70 x5
Standing Tricep Cable Pulldown - One Arm 40-45-50 x5

3:00 pm
Paused Squats 315-315-315,405-455
Iso Hammer Strength Inclined Press Machine ~135 80-105-115 x5
One Arm Cable Reverse Fly - High/Mid Pull 15-20-25-30 x5
Seated Bicep Curl Machine - One Arm 50-60-70 x5
Standing Tricep Cable Pulldown - One Arm 40-45-50 x5

* 455 again after 2 days. this week is another step in the right direction.

Mon Jun 23

6:00 am
Paused Squats 315-315-315,405
Iso Hammer Strength Inclined Press Machine ~135 80-105-115 x5
One Arm Cable Reverse Fly - High/Mid Pull 15-20-25-30 x5
Seated Bicep Curl Machine - One Arm 50-60-70 x5
Standing Tricep Cable Pulldown - One Arm 40-45-50 x5

7:00 pm
Paused Squats 315-315-315,405
Iso Hammer Strength Inclined Press Machine ~135 80-105-115 x5
One Arm Cable Reverse Fly - High/Mid Pull 15-20-25-30 x5
Seated Bicep Curl Machine - One Arm 50-60-70 x5
Standing Tricep Cable Pulldown - One Arm 40-45-50 x5

Tue Jun 24

6:00 am
Paused Squats 315-315-315,405
Iso Hammer Strength Inclined Press Machine ~135 80-105-115 x5
One Arm Cable Reverse Fly - High/Mid Pull 15-20-25-30 x5
Seated Bicep Curl Machine - One Arm 50-60-70 x5
Standing Tricep Cable Pulldown - One Arm 40-45-50 x5

7:00 pm
Paused Squats 315-315-315,405
Iso Hammer Strength Inclined Press Machine ~135 80-105-115 x5
One Arm Cable Reverse Fly - High/Mid Pull 15-20-25-30 x5
Seated Bicep Curl Machine - One Arm 50-60-70 x5

Wed Jun 25

6:00 am
Paused Squats 315-315-315,405
Iso Hammer Strength Inclined Press Machine ~135 80-105-115 x5
One Arm Cable Reverse Fly - High/Mid Pull 15-20-25-30 x5
Seated Bicep Curl Machine - One Arm 50-60-70 x5
Standing Tricep Cable Pulldown - One Arm 40-45-50 x5

7:00 pm
Paused Squats 315-315-315,405
Iso Hammer Strength Inclined Press Machine ~135 80-105-115 x5
One Arm Cable Reverse Fly - High/Mid Pull 15-20-25-30 x5
Seated Bicep Curl Machine - One Arm 50-60-70 x5
Standing Tricep Cable Pulldown - One Arm 40-45-50 x5

Thur Jun 26

6:00 am
Paused Squats 315-315-315,405
Iso Hammer Strength Inclined Press Machine ~135 80-105-115 x5
One Arm Cable Reverse Fly - High/Mid Pull 15-20-25-30 x5
Seated Bicep Curl Machine - One Arm 50-60-70 x5
Standing Tricep Cable Pulldown - One Arm 40-45-50 x5

7:00 pm
Paused Squats 315-315-315,405
Iso Hammer Strength Inclined Press Machine ~135 80-105-115 x5
One Arm Cable Reverse Fly - High/Mid Pull 15-20-25-30 x5
Seated Bicep Curl Machine - One Arm 50-60-70 x5
Standing Tricep Cable Pulldown - One Arm 40-45-50 x5

Friu Jun 27

6:00 am
Paused Squats 315-315-315,405
Iso Hammer Strength Inclined Press Machine ~135 80-105-115 x5
One Arm Cable Reverse Fly - High/Mid Pull 15-20-25-30 x5
Seated Bicep Curl Machine - One Arm 50-60-70 x5
Standing Tricep Cable Pulldown - One Arm 40-45-50 x5

7:00 pm
Paused Squats 315-315-315,405
Iso Hammer Strength Inclined Press Machine ~135 80-105-115 x5
One Arm Cable Reverse Fly - High/Mid Pull 15-20-25-30 x5
Seated Bicep Curl Machine - One Arm 50-60-70 x5
Standing Tricep Cable Pulldown - One Arm 40-45-50 x5

Sat Jun 29

6:00 am
Paused Squats 315-315-315,405
Iso Hammer Strength Inclined Press Machine ~135 80-105-115 x5
One Arm Cable Reverse Fly - High/Mid Pull 15-20-25-30 x5
Seated Bicep Curl Machine - One Arm 50-60-70 x5
Standing Tricep Cable Pulldown - One Arm 40-45-50 x5

4:00 pm
Paused Squats 315-315-315,405-455
Iso Hammer Strength Inclined Press Machine ~135 80-105-115 x5
One Arm Cable Reverse Fly - High/Mid Pull 15-20-25-30 x5
Seated Bicep Curl Machine - One Arm 50-60-70 x5
Standing Tricep Cable Pulldown - One Arm 40-45-50 x5
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Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« Last post by LBSS on June 22, 2025, 08:06:24 pm »
- climb x 30 mins
just the very easiest routes (yellow, red, green) in the big room since it'd been so long, and also my left bicep was protesting a little.

later, ~7 PM

- run 58:27, 10.10 km
abandoned all thought of doing an actual long run in this heat. T+DI 165/56 (90/32 + 75/24). sun wasn't too intense, given time of day, but still just hot and humid. HR was a little lower (138) and pace just a little quicker (5:47 vs. 5:52) than yesterday.

ETA: hydration was 600mL of my first batch of DIY electrolyte drink in the ~90 mins before heading out and 500mL of same on the run. no headache, felt good afterward. i bought one of those sweat patch kits, will be interesting to see what data i get from that.
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Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: warpspeed to the new scenario
« Last post by Joe on June 22, 2025, 08:56:27 am »
22-06-25

Run -- 16.00k, 1:38:23 [avg HR 132]

Seated Calf Raise --
45kg x a bunch
55kg x a bunch
45kg x a bunch

Notes

Nabbed the treadmill under the air con unit at the gym, so this was nice. Again really don't mind treadmill it seems, didn't get bored. Just lock into pace and listen to my thing and roll on. Was like 30 mins @ 6:19, 40 mins @ 6:00, 10 mins @ 5:43 which I decided was too fast (HR averaged 136 in that portion, didn't seem to be drifting, but it touched 140 which I didn't want), back to 6:00 for a while then last 2k at 6:40 to chill a bit. Tbh love having this much control over exactly how I'm running.

Counted breaths at various points and was always 20-22 per minute, even during the 5:43 portion.

On the one hand I believe that the seated calf raise is a trash-tier exercise (every study comparing seated vs standing shwos that both produce equivalent soleus gainz, but only standing trains the gastroc meaningfully), but on the other hand it is more fun to do for whatever reason. Could set up on the leg press machine for some calf raises but that's just takes too much time, whereas this is trivial to get going.

Over last couple weeks have been getting a little bit of arch pain here and there in my right foot. That's the side with the less mobile ankle/weaker calf, previous hip issue etc. So given that obvs my hips are not meaningfully weak (rdls, airplanes, etc), I guess calves must be the weak link, esp since that's more foot specific. So calf gym work can only be a good idea, esp since it's also a bomb way to stretch, since you can just hold the bottom position for 3s+ per rep, so across like 30 reps that's 90s of weighted intense stretching. Arguably this is a case where seated is better for me b/c straight leg ankle mobility is fine on both sides, but bent is poor on right side. Anyway, will try to do those after runs any time I use the gym. Can just do one of my classic drop or myo sets.

Oh 70k for the week  :personal-record: :personal-record: partly aided by doing long run in aircon/on treadmill, but avg pace for the week is basically same as always, i just somehow ran for 7 hours instead of the usual 6:30. Mostly a result of making an effort to keep all my weekday runs 50mins +, those 3-8 mins/day really add up. Not sure I can extend much past 70k/week without just getting faster.

ETA: other nice thing abt treadmill is it is easier to bring more liquids. Consumed like 1.2L during this which wd just be annoying outdoors.

ETA: also, evidence for my somewhat (played-up for effect) HR-sceptical stance. I was surely fresher yesterday than today, trained at about same time with same pre-workout nutrition, both on treadmill, etc etc. Today, HR never went above 140 and spent <1 min over 138, no HR drift, etec. Yesterday, I was 138 @ 6:19, 144 @ 6:00 and 147 @ 5:43. Exact same paces today were 128, 134, 136 avg. Used same HR strap. Now one confounder is using a different treadmill, maybe yesterday's had a faster belt. But still, interesting!
36
Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« Last post by LBSS on June 21, 2025, 02:30:25 pm »
right, yes, that penny just dropped. interesting. i'm going to stick with my current plan for now but definitely want to try it in the future.

- run 59:16, 10.12 km
did not look at watch, ran purely by RPE with the goal of keeping it easy. T+DI 154/50 (air temp 88/31, dew point 66/19), so the first real summer run of the year. there were a couple of hot days in may but this is a different level. and, as everyone says, temperature plays hell with HR: averaged 148 and went as high as 165 despite keeping breathing slow and even, apart from the tops of a couple of hills. so idk, at least until i adapt to the heat a little, maybe the only thing i should worry about on days that are meant to be run at easy pace is RPE.

i weighed myself before and after, as well. drank 500mL of water during the run. net weight loss was 2.3 pounds/1.04 kg (161-158.7). run was almost exactly an hour, so that means when it's hot and humid i lose about 2.8 pounds or about 1.27 kg/L of water per hour. for longer runs that means i should be drinking more like 750mL per hour; i think for a short run like that 500mL is ok. might be time to break out the hydration pouch for my long run tomorrow.

got a little floater in my vision now, on the right side.
37
Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: warpspeed to the new scenario
« Last post by Joe on June 21, 2025, 08:31:26 am »
21-06-25

AM

Treadmill Run - 13.02k, 70 mins

Pace - RR - HR
7:04 - 22 - 131
6:40 - 20 - 133
6:19 - 19 - 138
6:00 - 19 - 144
5:43 - 21 - 147
5:27 - 22 - 148
5:13 - 23 - 151
5:00 - 26 - 155
4:48 - 29 - 158
4:37 - 30 - 162
4:26 - 32 - 165
4:17 - 38 - 170
4:08 - 44 - 174
6:40 - 24/21 - 145

Lift Upper

Lat Pulldown drop set into one arm lat pulldown drop set

Machine bench drop set

Machine dip drop set

Chest-supported row drop set

Machine OHP drop set

Notes

Did the step test instead of my usual 10 x 3'/1'. If we buy the model the run argument that LT1 and VT1 are about the same, I guess mine is ~25. Checks out since on easy runs when I've counted I'm normally breathing 20-24 per min.

First 11 all 5 mins, 4:08 was 2:30, 6:40 was 7:30. Two RRs for the last one since i did at like 3 mins in and for the last min, just to see how it changed. Otherwise all RR readings were taken for approx the last minute (tho really from 3:30-4:30 of the rep to give me time to adjust pace on watch etc).

HR correlations slightly confounded since on weekend I run post-coffee/post-medication, whereas on weekdays I run before either of those. Also this was indoors, airconned, treadmill vs outdoors, hot, undulating. Anyway, might use this and let pace move around a bit more on easy runs as long as I'm sub ~24 breaths/minute. The article was less clear on using it to demarcate LT2, but based on HR/feel/pace correlations etc, 38 also seems about right there. As I noted the other day, last mins on reps was like 37. So, looks like things be gucci.

Also, kind of enjoyed doing this on the treadmill, nice to just set it and forget it.

Will do leg lifting in the pm to split things up.


PM

1A Rev Nord
10 x 10 + BW x 5
10 x 6 + BW x 5

1B RDL
130 x 10 + 120 x 5

2A Airplane
24 x 6, 5

2B Copenhagen Plank
7.5 x 7, 5 + Iso

3A Lateral
17.5 x Lots + some + fewer

3B Hammer Curl
17.5 x lots + some + fewer
38
Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: warpspeed to the new scenario
« Last post by Joe on June 20, 2025, 04:42:51 pm »
when do you think the a/c turning point will be for the UK? it's been ubiquitous in the states for decades, i've never lived in a house without it.

at homes? maybe new builds have them, not sure tbh. my office aircon is great, at least.

btw check out the latest magness video, especially the first and last 3 seconds  :uhhhfacepalm:
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Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« Last post by Joe on June 20, 2025, 03:57:31 pm »
that was interesting. i'm not sure i'm going to start using it imminently, but i like the guy's style. funny to note that the first comment is a reference for more fancy gear. clicked through to the norwegian singles article and that seems like it would be interesting to try, maybe next year if i manage to get through this year with a real build up in training consistency and volume. i kind of have qualifying for boston as a back-of-the mind goal now. and getting faster over shorter distances. like, touch wood the rest of the year goes well, i achieve my ultra goals, and maybe next year i dial in on 18:xx 5k and sub-3:00 marathon.

made an appointment with a neurologist for the end of july, earliest i could get in with one that's in-network and came with a strong referral for migraines specifically.

norwegian singles is what i've been doing for the last while. it just feels very manageable/sensible, structured like a good lifting programme (put you near, but shy your recoverable volume, progress absolute load but keep relative load approximately same, only moving that lever when you need to, etc). also just never have to think about sessions, which i enjoy, happy to lock into a boring thing and do it on repeat. there's a good strava group and subreddit for it with lots of stuff about how people have adapted it to the marathon.
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Progress Journals & Experimental Routines / Re: a fast and explosive donkey!
« Last post by LBSS on June 20, 2025, 09:12:09 am »
that was interesting. i'm not sure i'm going to start using it imminently, but i like the guy's style. funny to note that the first comment is a reference for more fancy gear. clicked through to the norwegian singles article and that seems like it would be interesting to try, maybe next year if i manage to get through this year with a real build up in training consistency and volume. i kind of have qualifying for boston as a back-of-the mind goal now. and getting faster over shorter distances. like, touch wood the rest of the year goes well, i achieve my ultra goals, and maybe next year i dial in on 18:xx 5k and sub-3:00 marathon.

made an appointment with a neurologist for the end of july, earliest i could get in with one that's in-network and came with a strong referral for migraines specifically.
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