Author Topic: Hip flexors  (Read 17798 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

bball2020

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 644
  • Respect: +66
    • View Profile
Hip flexors
« on: August 09, 2010, 02:52:19 pm »
0
Confused on what role hip flexor strength play in sprints and jumps ...like should they be trained per say?

Joe

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2356
  • Goobernatorial
  • Respect: +1091
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Hip flexors
« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2010, 03:04:31 pm »
0
They do not play much of a role in jumps. In sprints, however, they may play an important role. They allow you to bring the front knee higher faster and are conducive for a faster turnover rate, due to this. There was a study done that compared Asafa Powell to a Japanese sprinter who ran 10.0 for the 100m. Asafa Powell's hip flexors (I do not remember if the study made a distinction between the different hip flexors, nor can I find the study again) were far larger than the Japanese sprinters, this is not enough to say that they make a huge difference, but does seem to point to them as having some role in sprint speed.

A common recommendation for building the hip flexors for sprinting specifically is to do high knees and B skips (search these on youtube) while maintaining correct posture. Decline situps can be useful as well. Decline situp isos with the body more or less parallel to the ground are effective for building the hip flexors in a stretched position: most people's hip flexors are weak in this position due to hours of sitting.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lpiKvtHU5Xo" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lpiKvtHU5Xo</a>
« Last Edit: August 09, 2010, 03:10:34 pm by Joe »
"i threaten to kill myself whenever my parnets tell me to get a job" - bjpenn

LanceSTS

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2255
  • Respect: +550
    • View Profile
    • http://www.youtube.com/user/LanceSTS
    • Email
Re: Hip flexors
« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2010, 04:13:24 pm »
0
  Well there are alot of different opinions on the hip flexors, in regards to jumping they are alot more important in single leg jumps than double leg.  They are definitely not the most important muscle group nor are they close to it, but in single leg jumping the hip flexors of the non jumping leg assist in driving the knee up, creating a lightening effect on the body.  In sprinting there were studies done that showed elite sprinters stride length was long enough due to the power created in each stride that being extremely quick on the "cycling" phase, or bringing the opposite knee up and through was not neccessary and in fact they had more time in this phase than slower sprinters due to the power created in each ground contact.  They are still important imo but not to the degree that was once thought, where alot of speed coaches were preaching hip flexors as the determining factor.  Having tight hip flexors inhibits the hell out of the glutes though so stretching and mobility is extremely important. 
Relax.

LanceSTS

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2255
  • Respect: +550
    • View Profile
    • http://www.youtube.com/user/LanceSTS
    • Email
Re: Hip flexors
« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2010, 04:22:53 pm »
0
  And as far as working the hip flexors in training, I like ghr straight leg weighted sit ups and different hanging leg and knee raise variations.  The dynamic work for the hip flexors occurs during things like hurdle jumps, tuck jumps,  box jumps, and of course sprinting and different skipping variants.  
Relax.

adarqui

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 34034
  • who run it.
  • Respect: +9110
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Hip flexors
« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2010, 09:52:47 pm »
0
everyone said good things already, so ya i agree.. hip flexors are not that important in DLRVJ, get more important in SLRVJ, and become very important in sprinting.. another thing you could do is 4-way hip for the hip flexion, if you have one of those, that's what those WGF guys prescribe.. various types of resisted hip flexor training can have a positive impact on sprint speed.

kellyB actually posted some studies on db forum not too long ago regarding hip flexor training and sprint speed, there was a positive correlation from what i remember.

peace



edit: from kellyb in some thread:

"
Training the hip flexors can make you faster

Effects of Hip Flexor Training on Sprint, Shuttle Run, and Vertical Jump Performance
DEANE, RUSSELL S.; CHOW, JOHN W.; TILLMAN, MARK D.; FOURNIER, KIM A.

The Journal of Strength & Conditioning Research. 19(3):615-621, August 2005.


EFFECTS OF HIP FLEXOR TRAINING ON SPRINT, SHUTTLE RUN, AND VERTICAL JUMP PERFORMANCE. run tim...
:
Although hip flexion is integral in sports, hip flexion exercises are seldom emphasized in strength and conditioning for sports performance. This study aimed to determine whether a hip flexor resistance-training program could improve performance on a variety of tasks. Thirteen men and 11 women completed an 8-week hip flexion resistance-training program. Eleven men and 13 women served as controls. Isometric hip flexion strength, 40-yd dash time and the time for the first 10-yds, 4 x 5.8-m shuttle run time, and vertical jump height were evaluated at the beginning and end of the training and control period. Improvements were observed in the training group but not in the control group. Individuals in the training group improved hip flexion strength by 12.2% and decreased their 40-yd and shuttle run times by 3.8% and 9.0%, respectively. An increase in hip flexion strength can help to improve sprint and agility performance for physically active, untrained individuals."

steven-miller

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 879
  • Respect: +63
    • View Profile
Re: Hip flexors
« Reply #5 on: August 10, 2010, 04:52:39 pm »
0
I would however be careful to draw conclusions based on this study. I mean, what relevance does improving sprint times have for untrained individuals? Hence, why in hell did those guys conduct this study? And the more important question, should we really prescribe training advice for athletes based on a study on non-athletes?
I am sure Kelly has the personal experience to come to his own conclusions which are probably worth a lot more than this research. I am just saying that studies like that don't say much.

bball2020

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 644
  • Respect: +66
    • View Profile
Re: Hip flexors
« Reply #6 on: August 26, 2010, 11:51:05 pm »
0
so wouldnt there be a decent carryover to 1 leg running vert, and a mild carryover to 2 leg?

steven-miller

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 879
  • Respect: +63
    • View Profile
Re: Hip flexors
« Reply #7 on: August 27, 2010, 06:05:38 am »
0
so wouldnt there be a decent carryover to 1 leg running vert, and a mild carryover to 2 leg?

Why would you think that, especially the latter? I mean in the 1 leg running vert, maybe a little bit since the non-jumping leg will be pulled high. But in the double legged jump there is not even any significant hip flexion that occurs. I doubt that you would get a lot out of it, especially if you are a trained athlete and not a "physically active, untrained individual".

adarqui

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 34034
  • who run it.
  • Respect: +9110
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Hip flexors
« Reply #8 on: August 27, 2010, 06:11:14 am »
0
so wouldnt there be a decent carryover to 1 leg running vert, and a mild carryover to 2 leg?

Why would you think that, especially the latter? I mean in the 1 leg running vert, maybe a little bit since the non-jumping leg will be pulled high. But in the double legged jump there is not even any significant hip flexion that occurs. I doubt that you would get a lot out of it, especially if you are a trained athlete and not a "physically active, untrained individual".

ya i don't see much transfer happening to dlrvj, but slrvj yes..

Raptor

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14552
  • Respect: +2469
    • Yahoo Instant Messenger - raptorescu
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Hip flexors
« Reply #9 on: August 27, 2010, 08:32:36 am »
0
In a single leg jump the faster you go with your non-jumping knee upwards the better... it takes away part of your bodyweight.

austrian87

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 7
  • Respect: +1
    • View Profile
Re: Hip flexors
« Reply #10 on: December 06, 2010, 04:35:03 am »
0
Hi i'm new here and this is my first replie. (sry for my poor english)

I try to improve jump and sprint performance since three years now.
I think hip movement is the most important factor in sprinting and single leg jumping.
For example stand on a weight scale and drive your knee up as fast as you can. Look at the scale and you know what i mean.
For me it's unbelieveable that no one trains the hipflexors. There are millions of youtube vid with heavy lifts like squats and deadlifts and all that stuff, but no hipflexor exercises like one leg weighted situps or weighted leg raises. poor!

The two most important musclegroups are the hip flexors and the two jointed hamstrings.
The quads aren't very important in RSL movements. Most of you won't beliebe this.

Doing MaxEffort bulgarin split squats with dbs makes your two-joined hamstrings extreme sore! But not your quads!
Because the power come from the hips. It's very important to have a super strong core to transfer the power!

I think the reason is because the hip joint is a fix point. One leg drives forward (hipflexor work) and the other backwards (hamstring and little glute work) this result in a fix hip joint position.

The sprint trainer barry ross write an article: http://www.dragondoor.com/articler/mode3/269/
And i read a study about the corelation of hamstring strenght and sprint times. That's also a reason why deadlifts are great for sprinting especially SL deadlifts.

End result: hip movement have highest priority in sprinting/ SLRJ for me
                  calv movement have second highest.


Raptor

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14552
  • Respect: +2469
    • Yahoo Instant Messenger - raptorescu
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Hip flexors
« Reply #11 on: December 06, 2010, 05:53:24 am »
0
Yeah you bring some good points and I agree with you... more hip flexor work is imperative for good single leg jumping and sprinting, and it is indeed ignored. The problem is - most people aren't going to be limited by that. That's why the squats and strength movements still are the basic foundation of training.

It's interesting you mention the dumbbell BSS variant - I just did that yesterday and I have such sore glutes today you can't believe. Not much hamstring soreness though but probably the weight wasn't that much to challenge my hams which are very strong anyway. It also depends what kind of a stance you use when you do them (how much of a step forwards you take with the working leg).

If you look at Ced Norman, he does a lot of hip flexor training stuff, usually working with ankle weights to overload the legs a bit and make them heavier for exercises like leg raises etc.

Still, you can't say the quads aren't important, because the quads prevent the knee collapse in the amortization phase. That manages the amount of speed you can use in your plants which is extremely important in terms of elastic accumulation.

adarqui

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 34034
  • who run it.
  • Respect: +9110
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Hip flexors
« Reply #12 on: December 07, 2010, 05:30:19 am »
0
Hi i'm new here and this is my first replie. (sry for my poor english)

I try to improve jump and sprint performance since three years now.
I think hip movement is the most important factor in sprinting and single leg jumping.
For example stand on a weight scale and drive your knee up as fast as you can. Look at the scale and you know what i mean.
For me it's unbelieveable that no one trains the hipflexors. There are millions of youtube vid with heavy lifts like squats and deadlifts and all that stuff, but no hipflexor exercises like one leg weighted situps or weighted leg raises. poor!

The two most important musclegroups are the hip flexors and the two jointed hamstrings.
The quads aren't very important in RSL movements. Most of you won't beliebe this.

the quads are hip flexors..



Quote
Doing MaxEffort bulgarin split squats with dbs makes your two-joined hamstrings extreme sore! But not your quads!
Because the power come from the hips. It's very important to have a super strong core to transfer the power!

the quads rarely get sore with any lift, they are pretty much always stronger than the hamstrings.



Quote
I think the reason is because the hip joint is a fix point. One leg drives forward (hipflexor work) and the other backwards (hamstring and little glute work) this result in a fix hip joint position.

The sprint trainer barry ross write an article: http://www.dragondoor.com/articler/mode3/269/
And i read a study about the corelation of hamstring strenght and sprint times. That's also a reason why deadlifts are great for sprinting especially SL deadlifts.

sure hamstrings are more important for sprinting than jumping, the quads still absorb a ton of force during each foot contact during a sprint, and stabilize the patella.



Quote
End result: hip movement have highest priority in sprinting/ SLRJ for me
                  calv movement have second highest.



sprinting/SLRVJ have more contribution from hamstrings, for sure.. for double leg jumping, quads become extremely important.. regardless, quads always absorb a majority of the force in each movement.

as for hip flexors, sure training them directly may help in SLRVJ, most definitely will help with sprinting, but for double leg jumping, not so important.. hip flexors get strong and powerful simply by sprinting, for the most part.

peace

DamienZ

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 991
  • Yeah dude!
  • Respect: +47
    • View Profile
Re: Hip flexors
« Reply #13 on: December 07, 2010, 07:00:32 am »
0
arent the quads more important at the start of a sprint and at top speed its more posterior chain?
because then, standing jumps would be very much quad dominant...

i think hip flexors could play a role in double leg jumps as they help you get into position faster

Raptor

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14552
  • Respect: +2469
    • Yahoo Instant Messenger - raptorescu
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Hip flexors
« Reply #14 on: December 07, 2010, 12:56:10 pm »
0
Standing jumps ARE quad dominant. But in a correct sprint start, you better believe the posterior chain is engaged A LOT. I think if anything, the posterior chain is always engaged in a sprint, while the quads are only engaged in the begging more and the hamstrings start to kind of take over after you get out of the dig phase.