Author Topic: Planning my training ahead  (Read 6767 times)

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Raptor

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Planning my training ahead
« on: October 12, 2010, 05:56:02 pm »
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OK, I'm probably going to start going to the gym starting with the next week, trying to improve first hypertrophy, then kindly switch into strength work, then more power (~February) and then some plyo work (March) and then just enjoy the results.

Right know the knee is pretty much in the same shape as it was ~9 months ago, but I guess it will allow me to do low bar squats. The problem is - my wrists, elbows and shoulders hurt incredibly and if they do get in that condition, they recover very, very slowly, which means I could possibly be sidetracked for a few weeks before I can squat again.

My plan is something like this:

Workout A1: Squat increase + Straight leg one-leg RDL + Leg curls + Shoulders
Workout B1: BSS  + Bench press + Pullups
Workout A2: Squat + Backward lunge + Leg curls + Shoulders
Workout B2: Power Clean + Incline bench press + Chinups

The program will be Wednesday - Friday - Sunday, with the increase in poundages occuring on Wednesday. Odd weeks will be A1 - B1 - A2, even weeks will be A1 - B2 - A2.

In terms of reps involved in the squat, I want to start with 3x8 in the squat for A1 and then use the same weight for A2, but this time go for 4x10. Then increase the weight by 2.5 kg for every A1 workout. For the bench press, I'd do the same but going 3x10 and 4x15. I want some bodybuilding type of training for some time for my upperbody (chest and shoulders).

Anyway, my plan is to go with this and work on stuff, maybe do a few cycles at these rep ranges, and then go with 4x5 and 3x8 instead of the 3x8 and 4x10 for the squat, while for the bench press I'd go with 3x8 and 4x10 from the former 3x10 and 4x15.

For the assistance exercises I'll probably do 2x8. I might play with the rest periods as well, just to make some different adaptations. It's nothing set in stone, but this is the general idea.

In the off days I could do some ab work, med ball core work and ab wheel rollouts as well. Maybe some KB swings if they don't hurt my knees.

If you have any suggestions please shoot...

My goals are to get a 2x squat at least a projected one if not a real one by end of February 2011, if no injuries happen. I'll also take some protein supplements, probably a high % of protein with a low % of carbs, trying to increase muscle mass and take fat off in the spring (that's a very important part that I have ignored in the past). So basically my goal is to squat ~170 projected at a bodyweight of ~85 kg, and then decrease bodyfat and stabilize at ~75 kg (I have plenty of bodyfat right now to lose and with an even greater % if weight gain is desired, a 10 kg loss of fat doesn't seem that dramatic).

I'd probably lose some strength but I feel it's for a good cause.

So, like I said, any ideas would be great. I'd love to jump off two feet but I feel like I can gain a lot in my one-leg jumping as well, thus the focus should be on posterior chain strength.

I have included both hip extension and knee flexion exercises (leg curls) for my hamstrings, with the GHR being out of the discussion.

steven-miller

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Re: Planning my training ahead
« Reply #1 on: October 13, 2010, 11:03:56 am »
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Regarding the A2 work-out and those 4 x 10 squats - what would be the purpose of that work-out? 3 x 8 with weekly increases could work well for you though. But that is a lot of volume already for max strength gains. Instead of doing the 4 x 10 squats I would do a high intensity day with more weight than on A1 but lower reps, maybe 3s and increase A2 along with A1. You could utilize the MSEM method on that day two, would be pretty much the same purpose. I would do that as long as it works. B1 could work well as recovery day if you don't go really crazy on the BSS and if you are adapted to the movement. Powercleans would work for now, too, but will later be more difficult to incorporate as recovery. But right now I don't think it will be problematic for you.

Upper body looks good besides that I like overhead press + bench press more than incline bench press + bench press because it (the press) is generally a good movement which involves the whole body more opposed to the incline and is also a little less similar to the bench press. Goals are looking very good to me! With that volume you might be surprised at the end that you did not get that fat after all. So 75 might not even be necessary, but you can evaluate that for yourself once you are there.

Good luck with it!

Raptor

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Re: Planning my training ahead
« Reply #2 on: October 13, 2010, 04:21:29 pm »
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You bring up some good points, and thanks for reading all that stuff that I wrote (if you indeed read it all :P).

In terms of the rep range, I kind of want to go crazy on the reps per set for a while and also keeping the weight low. The reason for that is to allow my arms to adapt (since if I go very heavy my elbows get tendinitis or whatever from the low bar position and I'm out). So in that time I'll work on flexibility as well while keeping the weight on the bar "low" (think 80-100 kg).

Then, after I finish a few cycles of 3x8 and 4x10, I'll go with 4x5 and 3x8, so more weight and intensity, less volume. Kind of like transitioning into strength from hypertrophy. And then it's probably going to be pure strength.

Hopefully my health will allow me to do this.

Oh and yeah, I'll do bench press and overhead press, makes more sense. And it's going to be interesting in terms of recovery... I guess I just have to deal with that as I progress, and make whatever adjustments I see fit.

adarqui

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Re: Planning my training ahead
« Reply #3 on: October 14, 2010, 08:07:03 am »
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will check this out tmw, forgot to read it ! its in my todo list tab tho ;)

pc

Raptor

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Re: Planning my training ahead
« Reply #4 on: October 14, 2010, 08:52:35 am »
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What? You FORGOT?

What could be more important than this??? TAKE YOUR WORDS BACK OR ELSE!

steven-miller

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Re: Planning my training ahead
« Reply #5 on: October 14, 2010, 05:16:10 pm »
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@Raptor: I had the same thing for a while with the low-bar squats, I even logged it way back in my journal. Although I had decent technique my elbows did hurt doing heavy weights. The same happened to some people on Mark Rippetoe's board. Adjusting the grip width has helped in all those cases as far as I know - including myself. I have had problems for weeks with this and taking a slightly wider grip made a small but noticeable difference until the pain subsided completely after a few work-outs. I have never had any elbow problems with squats again after that, even when going max. So you might want to give that a try!

Raptor

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Re: Planning my training ahead
« Reply #6 on: October 14, 2010, 05:22:03 pm »
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Yes but I can smash my palms in the supports if I somehow forgot where they are or if I cramp and need to get the bar on the supports immediately. I will try, in the meantime I need to work with shoulder dislocations and stretches, and use a lower weight. Eventually, I could put my palms higher and not really keep them on the bar but a bit over it.

Raptor

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Re: Planning my training ahead
« Reply #7 on: October 15, 2010, 03:20:04 pm »
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I'm going to the gym this Sunday to start the "thing"... hopefully I can do well.

I'll start with a 80 kg bar this first workout.

Raptor

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Re: Planning my training ahead
« Reply #8 on: October 18, 2010, 11:12:02 am »
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As I felt so bad the last time I went to the gym, and spent a lot of time in the gym, I'm thinking of going more often and keeping the sessions shorter.

I might also try this: http://www.adarq.org/forum/performance-training-blog/the-ratio-technique/

I think I can organize stuff so that I do like 3 workouts of hypertrophy oriented squats (say, 3x8), then go with 3x5 and then go with MSEM and reset the cycle.

I want to write here my program in this fashion, since I really want to go this way with more frequency, better intensity, go home. After I'm done eating I'll start writing.

Raptor

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Re: Planning my training ahead
« Reply #9 on: October 18, 2010, 11:59:39 am »
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OK, so I want to go with this now:

Sunday: Squat + One-leg RDL++Leg curls (++ = superset)
Monday: Bench press + Triceps pulldowns + Chinups
Tuesday: Power clean/Jump squat (low volumes) + BSS + Cable pulls
Wednesday: Overhead press + Lateral++Front shoulder raises + Pullups
Thursday: Squat + Lunge++Leg curls

Friday and Saturday rest. I'll do ab work and calf work everyday.

I'll also go with adarqui's http://www.adarq.org/forum/performance-training-blog/the-ratio-technique/ because it sounds very very nice. I'll use it for the squat and for the bench press.

So basically my first squat cycle will be:

80x3x8/82.5x3x8/85x3x8/95x3x5/105x2x3 MSEM and then continue from 85 kg

For the bench press it will be:

40x3x8/42.5x3x8/45x3x8/50x3x5/55x2x3 MSEM and then continue from 45 kg

If you have and further ideas I thank you in advance and await your input.

steven-miller

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Re: Planning my training ahead
« Reply #10 on: October 21, 2010, 08:37:04 am »
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I think what you write might be time efficient - for a late intermediate to advanced lifter. You are far from that and you should not over complicate things. There is really no need for this kind of complex programming where you have a hypertrophy stage, a strength stage and a maximum intensity stage. That would typically be useful for an advanced guy, who might want to gradually decrease volume but increase intensity, but certainly not for you. You should just worry about getting your 5 rm up and you will experience lots of hypertrophy and lots of maximal strength gains in a shorter period of time than what you are shooting for now.

That's my take on it.

Raptor

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Re: Planning my training ahead
« Reply #11 on: October 21, 2010, 09:11:24 am »
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Well I'm definitely going to have a very high % of work towards the hypertrophy side, but as a short stim/recovery, one week in 4 is going to be a strength & stim & recovery week, only to return to hypertrophy again.

I don't think there's anything wrong with that approach, changes the stimuli a bit, gives a moment to recover better and off we go with hypertrophy again.

steven-miller

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Re: Planning my training ahead
« Reply #12 on: October 21, 2010, 09:52:21 am »
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Well I'm definitely going to have a very high % of work towards the hypertrophy side, but as a short stim/recovery, one week in 4 is going to be a strength & stim & recovery week, only to return to hypertrophy again.

I don't think there's anything wrong with that approach, changes the stimuli a bit, gives a moment to recover better and off we go with hypertrophy again.

It's not wrong, it's just not time efficient and it also neglects the fact that plenty of hypertrophy is going to occur in lower rep ranges than 8s, too and that one can recover faster with less volume and still have enough hypertrophy to get stronger...

If you like your setup as it is, go for it. It might work. I just don't like that it is unnecessary complicated for the simple goal of getting stronger (and getting stronger is your goal, not hypertrophy, right?).

LBSS

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Re: Planning my training ahead
« Reply #13 on: October 21, 2010, 10:41:32 am »
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FWIW, I agree with steven-miller. Of course, it's a bit of pot calling the kettle black as my tendency is also to overcomplicate things. But it's always easier to tell someone else the right thing to do and in this case, I think you're probably better off with a simpler scheme. Why not just do Starting Strength or something, plus assistance for calves, arms and core? Or stronglifts 5x5? If you're eating right, you should grow plenty and gain a lot of strength on that.
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Raptor

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Re: Planning my training ahead
« Reply #14 on: October 21, 2010, 05:32:55 pm »
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So you guys are suggesting sets of 5 instead of sets of 8?

I'll consider that. I'll work for a while with the what I have planned for now, and observing what is going on, I might adjust it. I have like 4-5 months of strength training planned if no injuries occur, so that's plenty of time to change stuff it I need to.

Do you really think a 3x5 is enough stimuli for good hypertrophy to occur (if the food intake is right)? I'm more into hypertrophy than strength as my target right now, I want to switch to a more strength-focused rep range later (4-6).