Author Topic: The complete strength training guide by Greg Nuckols  (Read 695 times)

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CoolColJ

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The complete strength training guide by Greg Nuckols
« on: October 20, 2019, 06:02:59 pm »
+2
Basically, learn the lifts, pile on as much muscle as your genetics allow for, then practise and drive neural efficiency

https://www.strongerbyscience.com/complete-strength-training-guide/#Intermediate_Training

So if strength helps athletes, and strength is largely due to muscle mass increase after proficiency is gained, then neural efficiency in the lifts can be largely ignored to a point.
So just get your prime movers large

LBSS

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Re: The complete strength training guide by Greg Nuckols
« Reply #1 on: October 21, 2019, 04:16:05 am »
+1
oh man i love greg nuckols, had forgotten about him. thanks for posting this.
Muscles are nonsensical they have nothing to do with this bullshit.

- Avishek

sunday: long very easy run 80+ mins @ 5:40+ (14+ km)
monday: strength/cross training
tuesday: extensive tempo (7 km) OR fartlek (mostly easy pace with mix of strides, hills, long tempo) 45 mins (8+ km)
wednesday: easy run 60+ mins @ 5:20-5:30 (11+ km)
thursday: easy run 60+ mins @ 5:20-5:30 (11+ km), strength/cross-training
friday: rest
saturday: short tempo 6-8x500 @ sub-4:00 (7 km)

strength would be:
- hops 2x10
- box jumps or ME SVJ 2x5
- squats 3x6-8 or weighted BSS/lunges 3x10/leg
- RDL/hypers 2x10-12 or SLRDL 2x10-12/leg
- upper push myo-reps or sets to technical failure
- upper pull myo-reps or sets to technical failure
- leg raises, holds, pallof presses

Dreyth

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Re: The complete strength training guide by Greg Nuckols
« Reply #2 on: October 21, 2019, 02:11:09 pm »
+1
Awesome read!

My takeaway is that perhaps I've been overrating neural work for myself (3 rep work) and underrating higher rep work for mass (8+) and VOLUME

However, I got to this part:


Quote
Keep volume for your main lifts low to moderate, and stay at least 1-2 reps shy of failure at all times (avoiding technical failure).  You don’t need a ton of high quality, heavy work to maintain and improve neural factors, but getting the bulk of your training volume from your main lifts will generally beat you up a bit more, and limit how much total training volume you can handle per session and per week.

This goes against what I remember learning in a verkoshansky book, i believe it was. Basically you dont stimulate all of your muscles until you are basically just about at failure. I remember after learning this, i saw some pretty quick strength gains when i put an end to stopping 2-3 reps short. These days, I stop when I think my next rep will be a fail.



Also:

Quote
I recommend accessory lifts over lighter sets of squat, bench, and deadlift to cut down on risk of overuse injuries, and to keep training specificity high for the main lifts (since lifting heavy stuff for low reps and lighter stuff for higher reps are different skills, you don’t want to “water down” the motor learning you’re doing your main lifts, unless you’re splitting your training into more distinct phases, as we’ll discuss later).

I've always been a fan of "just squat more if I want to get better at my squat." But I never thought of 1) avoiding injuries by mixing it up, and 2) this would lower training specificity by watering down my big lifts with fatigued sets of higher reps
« Last Edit: October 21, 2019, 02:18:47 pm by Dreyth »
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CoolColJ

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Re: The complete strength training guide by Greg Nuckols
« Reply #3 on: October 22, 2019, 01:14:42 am »
0
regarding training to failure

https://twitter.com/BradSchoenfeld/status/1185669914079703041

so keeping a few reps in the tank can allow you to do more volume
« Last Edit: October 22, 2019, 01:17:18 am by CoolColJ »

Dreyth

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Re: The complete strength training guide by Greg Nuckols
« Reply #4 on: October 22, 2019, 11:27:01 am »
0
regarding training to failure

https://twitter.com/BradSchoenfeld/status/1185669914079703041

so keeping a few reps in the tank can allow you to do more volume

its behind a paywall :/
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Re: The complete strength training guide by Greg Nuckols
« Reply #6 on: October 25, 2019, 07:15:22 am »
+2
Quote
Given that heavy loads (1–5RM) cause hypertrophy without the need for fatigue, it seems likely that the final five reps of a set to failure can be defined as stimulating. The true number might be slightly smaller or slightly larger, and it might differ between individuals and muscles. In fact, it is likely to be quite a bit larger in completely untrained lifters, because they have far more motor units with muscle fibers that have not yet reached a plateau in size. Nevertheless, the final five reps of a set to failure is likely a fair benchmark, and we can therefore deduct reps when using RIR to identify the real training volume in each set. Training with 1RIR on each set involves four stimulating reps, training with 2RIR involves three stimulating reps, and so on.

https://medium.com/@SandCResearch/when-is-high-volume-training-not-actually-high-in-volume-4529810e930f

Quote
For example, when training with 5 sets of 10 reps with the same weight with the squat or bench press, taking 5 minutes rest between sets, and aiming to reach failure only on the final set, the proximity to failure is 7RIR on the first set, 4–5RIR on the second set, 3RIR on the third set, 2RIR on the fourth set, and 0RIR on the final set. The total number of stimulating reps is 10 or 11, which is smaller than you would achieve by doing 3 sets of 5 reps to failure.

« Last Edit: October 25, 2019, 07:17:36 am by CoolColJ »

Dreyth

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Re: The complete strength training guide by Greg Nuckols
« Reply #7 on: October 25, 2019, 12:49:04 pm »
+1
^^^ That's why I don't do 4 sets of 12 anymore or whatever. It's always something like 12-10-8-6 with a RIR of 1 on each set. I realized one day that if I do 4x12, then I have so much more left in the tank in the first couple of sets and maybe I'm not stimulating my muscles as much anymore

however i do want to switch up my training and add more high volume accessory work, especially while on my bulk currently. so thanks for making this thread!
« Last Edit: October 25, 2019, 12:51:41 pm by Dreyth »
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CoolColJ

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Re: The complete strength training guide by Greg Nuckols
« Reply #8 on: October 27, 2019, 08:38:28 am »
+2
Quote
Greg Nuckols
‏ @GregNuckols

Lazy programming tip:

Take any generally decent hypertrophy program, add 2-3 heavy singles (RPE 7-9ish) before the volume work for your main lifts, and you have yourself a pretty good year-round strength program for intermediate lifters.

CoolColJ

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Re: The complete strength training guide by Greg Nuckols
« Reply #9 on: November 23, 2019, 01:34:29 am »
+1
recommend you guys download and read this - some good studies here that are relevant to most of us

https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/strengtheory/MASS/Best+Of+Issue/MASS+Best+Of+2019.pdf?__s=xxxxxxx,qucxsmqo9jac6gigj9xw

training to failure really zaps the vertical jump for quite a while

Quote
Leave the Gym with a  Little Left in the TankStudy Reviewed: Time Course of Recovery From Resistance Exercise With Different Set Configurations. Pareja-Blanco et al. (2018)BY MICHAEL C. ZOURDOSWe’ve written about failure training a few times, but this study was a monster. It compared 10 different conditions and the time course of recovery with five conditions to failure and five conditions ranging between a 5-8RPE. So how close to failure should you train?

1. This paper examined the time course of recovery between training to failure and leaving some reps in the tank across different repetition ranges.2. In general, training to failure elongated recovery time versus non-failure training, with higher rep sessions to failure being particularly fatiguing.3. When putting this study into context, it provides evidence that it may be wise to avoid failure training, at least in some sessions, to meet weekly volume and frequency recommendations



Quote
Power Training or Speed Work
for Some, But Not All?
Study Reviewed: Increased Rate of Force Development During Periodized
Maximum Strength and Power Training is Highly Individual. Peltonen et al. (2018)
B Y M I C H A E L C . Z O U R D O S
MASS has already covered individualization, but new information
is emerging. In this study, rate of force development was
maximized by some people through heavy training and by others
through explosive training – but why? And what impact does
that have for strength and hypertrophy?

1. This study examined how some people respond better to power-type training and
some respond better to more traditional strength-type training.
2. To examine the responses to each type of training, 14 males trained for 10 weeks
with strength-type training and then for 10 weeks with power-type training.
3. Six people improved rate of force development only in the strength block, while four
people improved rate of force development only in the power block. Four people –
“non-responders” – did not improve rate of force development at all. Importantly,
all responders increased hypertrophy and strength to the same degree despite not
improving rate of force development

1. Some people improve rate of force development better through typical strength
training, while others improve it better through power-type training. Further, some
(non-responders) don’t improve rate of force development at all.
2. Non-responders also struggle to improve hypertrophy, but in the short term,
strength is not affected.
3. Those who are “maximum-strength responders” may not need to include power
or speed training; however, those who are power responders should likely include
power or speed training to maximize rate of force development, which can improve
neural efficiency and, subsequently, 1RM


This bit of this second study makes you think that muscle mass is the key.... :ninja:
So strength gains via neural adaption don't apply to RFD

Quote
Non-responders did not experience any
significant change in muscle cross-sec-
tional area despite training for 20 weeks;
however, non-responders had similar
strength gains to both responder groups.

Cross-sectional area measurements
showed hypertrophy (+12%) across all
responders with no difference (p>0.05)
between strength or power responders;
however, non-responders did not expe-
rience any hypertrophy (p>0.05). De-
spite greater hypertrophy in respond-
ers, strength increased similarly in all
groups (maximum strength responders:
+12.38%, power responders: +15.17%,
non-responders: +16.11%)
« Last Edit: November 23, 2019, 02:03:49 am by CoolColJ »

Dreyth

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Re: The complete strength training guide by Greg Nuckols
« Reply #10 on: November 24, 2019, 09:32:58 pm »
+2
So strength gains via neural adaption don't apply to RFD

Say what now?
I woulD have figured the strength gains were partially due to rate coding thus leading to RFD

Very interesting study. From personal experience all i needed to do was simply increase my squat:bw ratio while keep practicing my jumps and i was good to go. Never noticed any marked improvements from shock plyos, though i never took them seriously either. But my vert scaled directly with my squat:bw ratio, even back when i was a one footed jumper it did
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CoolColJ

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Re: The complete strength training guide by Greg Nuckols
« Reply #11 on: December 08, 2019, 08:07:07 am »
+2
Some ex phys folks working at Cern just released some very compelling research captured in the infographic below

So you get 90% of the benefit of a set by stopping 4 reps from failure in a 10RM load...



Israetel has been talking about this too, (stimulus to fatigue ratio)

Quote
rpdrmike
Because sets done with more than 5 reps in reserve cause so little growth but cause some fatigue, they aren’t the best way to train in most cases. And while sets taken to total failure or beyond cause the best growth, they also cause so much fatigue that training with them consistently is not sustainable. It’s likely that a middle ground of training, mostly done between 3 and 1 reps in reserve (RIR), is where you can benefit by training most often. Perhaps starting your mesocycles at around 4 RIR and matching reps week to week as you slowly add more weight to the bar and thus lowering your RIR until you reach failure is a viable form of training. After failure, you deload to drop fatigue, and start a new mesocycle at 4 RIR or so.

« Last Edit: December 08, 2019, 08:12:10 am by CoolColJ »

Dreyth

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Re: The complete strength training guide by Greg Nuckols
« Reply #12 on: December 09, 2019, 08:08:44 pm »
0
Interesting stuff. Makes me want to play around with like 6 sets of 6 with stuff left in the tank every set. Would probably feel incredible after the workout too without having the fatigue, but having the endorphins etc
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CoolColJ

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Re: The complete strength training guide by Greg Nuckols
« Reply #13 on: December 10, 2019, 12:44:15 am »
0
Interesting stuff. Makes me want to play around with like 6 sets of 6 with stuff left in the tank every set. Would probably feel incredible after the workout too without having the fatigue, but having the endorphins etc

That's how I'm squatting right now, pretty much - I do less than 50% of the rep maxes at 70-75-80%, cycling between each intensity range, per workout
Although I may drop the 80% range soon, and use 65% sets of 7, dropping to 6 after 3 sets, 70% sets of 5, dropping to 4 after 3 sets... and 75% sets of 4 dropping to 3 after 3 sets.
I can feel the bar speed slow down, and a bit more strain right at that point, which is when the largest, fastest, and less fatigue resistant muscle fibers are starting to drop out, hence the slower bar speed.

Training this way suits me better, as heavy loads spook me, and burn me out fast, and cause me more aches and pains.
Plus I train after BBall and jumping

So in theory if you stop all work sets at that point, your only developing the largest and fastest fibers, while keeping the slower ones mostly untrained...
So they are less likely to get in the way of explosiveness, and receive less damage so recovery overall is also better
That's the training model I'm subscribing to right now, anyway.



« Last Edit: December 10, 2019, 12:49:23 am by CoolColJ »