Author Topic: 27 Dead in Connecticut Shooting, Including 18 Children  (Read 21960 times)

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adarqui

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Re: 27 Dead in Connecticut Shooting, Including 18 Children
« Reply #15 on: December 14, 2012, 06:13:26 pm »
0
Is there anybody responsible in the USA besides the guy who commits the murder? Like the guy who sold the gun to that murderer, the psychiatric evaluator that said it's OK for him to have a gun (if that happens at all in the USA)?

no.. assuming he bought a gun legally, nobody is responsible but himself.. there's no psyche eval either.. it's very easy to get a gun in the usa.

if someone sold/gave him a gun illegally, then ya, they'd be in deep shit.. but i doubt that's what happened.




The year in review:

April 2: 7 people killed, 3 wounded at a small Christian college in Oakland.
July 20: 12 people killed, 58 wounded in the Aurora, CO theater shooting.
August 5: 6 people killed during Sunday services at a Sikh temple in Oak Creek, WI.
August 24: 2 people killed, 8 wounded outside the Empire State Building.
Sept. 27: 5 people killed at a Minneapolis, MN company office.
Oct. 21: 3 people killed in a Milwaukee, WI spa.
Today: At least 26 people killed – including 18 children - at Sandy Hook Elementary.

right, and this is just the 'public massacre killings'.. what's the death toll in Chicago for 2012, it's 500+ right?

500+ gun deaths in one city... ~2,300 total shootings i think for the year.. though i may be off on that stat, i saw something about it a few days ago.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/16/chicago-homicide-rate-wor_n_1602692.html
http://thenewamerican.com/usnews/crime/item/12217-chicago%E2%80%99s-murders-for-2012-likely-to-exceed-2011

seeing lots of crying reporters/politicians today.. usually don't see them so emotional.

pelham32

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Re: 27 Dead in Connecticut Shooting, Including 18 Children
« Reply #16 on: December 14, 2012, 06:14:02 pm »
0
Is there anybody responsible in the USA besides the guy who commits the murder? Like the guy who sold the gun to that murderer, the psychiatric evaluator that said it's OK for him to have a gun (if that happens at all in the USA)?

It's hard to place blame like that on any one except that man who did it. I do believe they were signs from behavior,attitude, what he had to say that gave clues to what he might do. In the military they give us briefings about twice a year about how to watch for signs and clues for people who may commit suicide. The people who recognized(if they did)these signs or odd behavior need to closely self examine themselves on why they didn't say anything. If this is the case, blame is on them as well imo because its almost like being an accessory. It's not a crime unless they knew about what he was going to do before hand and did not say anything. I'm pretty sure they can be arrested for that.
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Raptor

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Re: 27 Dead in Connecticut Shooting, Including 18 Children
« Reply #17 on: December 14, 2012, 07:09:20 pm »
-3
Wow ... in Romania guns with real bullets are not allowed to people... just with rubber bullets. And to get one you have to go through hell so...
December 14, 2012, 07:09:20 pm - Hidden. Show this post.

Mutumbo000

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Re: 27 Dead in Connecticut Shooting, Including 18 Children
« Reply #18 on: December 14, 2012, 09:46:00 pm »
0
Sad stuff. It begs the question how none of his family knew how fuked up he was. Columbine, Virginia Tech and now this. These massacres just keep getting worse and worse.
My local news is now saying it's 20 children and 28 people dead- http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/world/feared-dead-in-school-shooting/story-fnd11ay0-1226537283734
« Last Edit: December 14, 2012, 09:48:05 pm by Mutumbo000 »
"IMO, It didn't happen if it's not on vid/official"- adarqui

It's easier to keep up than it is to catch up...

adarqui

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Re: 27 Dead in Connecticut Shooting, Including 18 Children
« Reply #19 on: December 15, 2012, 04:30:47 am »
0
they are now saying those were his mom's weapons.. i wonder if she bought them for him? not sure why'd she buy a semi-auto assault rifle.

.223 bushmaster, glock, sig saur, etc.. ? for a kindergarten teacher? odd.

it'd be nice to have access to all of these shooter's detailed profiles/post psycho analysis research etc.. the official docs.. because it is mind blowing when you hear people talking about these "psychos" as if in every day life, they seemed very normal etc. that's what always interests me.. how someone who is seemingly very normal can just make the decision to do something so mindblowingly crazy.. from what I see, most of these shooters seem to know right from wrong.. hardly any of them are on the level of Jared Laughner (gabby giffords shooter) who just seems completely batshit. It's as if they just decide they want to end their lives but in doing so, they would like to leave some kind of major impact, as if it's becoming an american culture of young adult angst to end your life in a blaze of "glory". To somehow show others the "pain" you've had (or perceived yourself to have) to live with. It's not enough to just end their life, they need to become infamous, transfer their pain to others, and leave their mark before they kill themselves.

Correction on "young adult angst".. It seems to effect boys/men of nearly every age, 15 to 60 etc.

Have we even seen a female rampage shooter?

I keep thinking about how this may have been entirely different had this kid only had access to a 6 shot revolver.. Would he have gathered the type of weaponry to pull this off? Or would he have just killed his mom then himself.. Imagine being on the verge like that, but then having access to such an arsenal like he did.. The "power" must just consume these people. Kind of makes you wonder how all of these other murder-suicides end up in USA; Had they have had access to much more deadly weaponry, would their be even more massacre shootings?

adarqui

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Re: 27 Dead in Connecticut Shooting, Including 18 Children
« Reply #20 on: December 15, 2012, 05:39:50 am »
0
The only real solution is to enact a ban on ALL weaponry capable of firing more than a single shot. We need to move away from horrific massacres and back towards chivalrous duels. This way, open-carry laws can be supported nation-wide. Ordinary citizens, regardless of mental health, could wield their weapon proudly, knowing that if they do cross the line, it would take them at least 60 seconds to reload, at which point they would already be gunned down by several other single shot weapons fired from responsible citizens. In related news, such a movement would fuel the economy. No longer could you purchase a single weapon capable of 30 shots for $700 that fits in the palm of your hand. Instead, you would have to purchase thirty single shot weapons, at minimum $1,000, which are custom embroidered with your family crest. You may think i'm being sarcastic, but I am not. I'm actually serious. Single shot weapons infuse one with a sense of honor, respect, nobility, history, and bravery. Finally, the U.N. could then adopt these principles and declare a more primitive yet less devastating rule of war. Single shot weapons declaration & Cessation of Drug war for 2013/2014 would be great. #singleShotWeaponsForOurFuture









seriously though, imagine if all we had were single shot weapons...

adarqui

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Re: 27 Dead in Connecticut Shooting, Including 18 Children
« Reply #21 on: December 15, 2012, 05:55:49 am »
+1
a facebook reply to:

Nemu

i can't wait for someone to say, "well if all the teachers had guns this wouldn't have happened.", fuck it, let's go further, how about all the students go to school with guns, k-12, it would only make the place a lot safer according to right wingers.




Andrew Darqui:

as per my recent FB post, we could allow everyone to bring a gun to school, including 5 year old children, as long as it's a single shot weapon. But ya, teachers having guns wouldn't have had any effect on the initial impact of this shooter. Perhaps after he was done shooting 30 people, they could have been able to step in and end the situation, but the initial impact of someone with multiple hand guns with high round clips is impossible to stop. The only real deterrent might have been if there were a quarantine zone with metal detectors and an armed LEO on the other side of it. But I think that illustrates the real issue. USA needs to address this problem at it's roots, and that would be, IMO, it's violent war mongering culture. Every time one of these incidents occurs, it seems we lose a good opportunity to address the violent culture that's perpetuated every single day in this country. Have we seen a female massacre shooter yet? It's no coincidence that it's always a young man, I mean we spoon feed our male children through to adulthood a concoction of murder, death, kill, each and every day.. If it isn't on tv, it's at a movie theater, it's on a video game console, it's on the radio, it's on an mp3 player, and it's even in our sports. Guns aren't the issue imo, it's our fucked up country.

arnoud

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Re: 27 Dead in Connecticut Shooting, Including 18 Children
« Reply #22 on: December 15, 2012, 06:08:03 am »
-2
The gun lobby has a huge stake in the american government, stuff like this will happen over and over. A mall shooting happened over here in The Netherlands, and afterwards the government enforced heavier gun control....for people who are member of a shooting club.....who already have a hard time getting guns. People here in europe are amazed at the US gun policy. What happened to sticks and stones to defend yourself?

adarqui

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Re: 27 Dead in Connecticut Shooting, Including 18 Children
« Reply #23 on: December 15, 2012, 06:18:22 am »
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u.s. motto: sticks and stones may break my bones but semi automatic extended clip glocks will blow your fucking head off.

LanceSTS

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Re: 27 Dead in Connecticut Shooting, Including 18 Children
« Reply #24 on: December 15, 2012, 11:05:29 pm »
0
 
  Very sad deal, cant imagine how the parents feel right now...

Its also very sad that political groups are using this tragedy to push their agendas.


some discussion from another side of gun control:


http://www.isil.org/resources/lit/guns-safer.html

http://www.keepandbeararms.com/information/XcIBViewItem.asp?ID=1753

http://www.nopcradio.com/nopc-corner/tea-party-stand-up/82-it-s-time-to-arm-the-teachers-gun-free-zone-fail.html


some of the more valid points in the last one:


"The truth is the vast majority of mass shootings happen in "GUN FREE ZONES". These criminals understand well that they have the opportunity to cause maximum damage in that situation and that is why they don't frequent areas that guns are present."



"The gun control rats have singled out gun shows as places to to vent their rage. I challenge anyone to give a single example of a rape, robbery murder or mass shooting at any gun show in American history. Millions of guns on display at thousands of shows and not a single violent situation.

Our neighbor Mexico has had a long-standing total ban on firearms. That's not worked out too well for them or the families of the 50,000 murdered there last year by the banned firearms."

 
Relax.

Raptor

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Re: 27 Dead in Connecticut Shooting, Including 18 Children
« Reply #25 on: December 16, 2012, 06:52:00 am »
-3
Lance, I get you have a gun fetish but seriously... there's a big issue in the USA with that. No matter what Mexico examples you want to do, the reality is that the more guns are available to more people, the more gun crimes will happen.

You can make the argument that a knife can be used but it's not the same thing. A knife is lethal too, maybe even more than a gun, but the aggressor has to get into physical contact with the victim etc and some % of these guys are pussies/cowards to begin with, and having a gun gives them so much mental power of "I'm god, I have a gun" while at the same time giving them the ability to strike people at a distance, cowardly.

There's more to guns than just what comes to the eye first. Psychological factors, distance killing factors and so on and so forth.
December 16, 2012, 06:52:00 am - Hidden. Show this post.

LanceSTS

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Re: 27 Dead in Connecticut Shooting, Including 18 Children
« Reply #26 on: December 16, 2012, 07:31:32 am »
0
Lance, I get you have a gun fetish but seriously... there's a big issue in the USA with that. No matter what Mexico examples you want to do, the reality is that the more guns are available to more people, the more gun crimes will happen.

You can make the argument that a knife can be used but it's not the same thing. A knife is lethal too, maybe even more than a gun, but the aggressor has to get into physical contact with the victim etc and some % of these guys are pussies/cowards to begin with, and having a gun gives them so much mental power of "I'm god, I have a gun" while at the same time giving them the ability to strike people at a distance, cowardly.

There's more to guns than just what comes to the eye first. Psychological factors, distance killing factors and so on and so forth.

Those people will ALWAYS have guns, no matter what.  The people who obey the law are the ones who will follow it, not the criminals. 

And I dont have a gun fetish you USA hating fucktard, if a group of morons wanted to outlaw cars, I would oppose that as well. 



 
Relax.

arnoud

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Re: 27 Dead in Connecticut Shooting, Including 18 Children
« Reply #27 on: December 16, 2012, 07:40:55 am »
-1
Lance, obviously the gun ban in mexico doesn't work, but doesn't that say more about the power of their government? Isn't it still an argument that guns should be banned, because they bring so much death, be it legal or illegal? There's always good and evil people, and in my humble opinion the evil one should be restricted to get a gun as much as possible.

LanceSTS

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Re: 27 Dead in Connecticut Shooting, Including 18 Children
« Reply #28 on: December 16, 2012, 07:48:11 am »
0
Lance, obviously the gun ban in mexico doesn't work, but doesn't that say more about the power of their government? Isn't it still an argument that guns should be banned, because they bring so much death, be it legal or illegal?

I did not make the Mexico argument or example, it was in one of the links posted and raptard brought it up.  However, they have the gun laws as strict as can be, yet they have a HUGE issue.  The good cannot protect themselves, since they are the ones who DO NOT have guns.


Quote
There's always good and evil people, and in my humble opinion the evil one should be restricted to get a gun as much as possible.

I agree.  There needs to be more done in the process of allowing ownership and purchase of firearms, without restricting good people of their right to them.
Relax.

arnoud

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Re: 27 Dead in Connecticut Shooting, Including 18 Children
« Reply #29 on: December 16, 2012, 07:54:35 am »
-1
You can make gun laws as strict as possible, but if the neighbour country has no ban, it's my guess that it's still very easy to get guns. I have no way of verifying this, just my thought.
I don't buy the good people defending themselves with guns, if there were no guns in the first place for both sides, there would be lot less victims. Guns are all over the place though in the us because they are being mass produced. I know i'm being a bit too idealistic here...