Author Topic: Another Mass Shooting in the US  (Read 14159 times)

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Raptor

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Re: Another Mass Shooting in the US
« Reply #15 on: December 03, 2015, 03:22:00 pm »
0
Imagine if some arabs were to do this... the media would be all over it. But since it's local gun violence, that's just "another mass shooting, let's move on".

LBSS

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Re: Another Mass Shooting in the US
« Reply #16 on: December 03, 2015, 03:27:29 pm »
0
Imagine if some arabs were to do this... the media would be all over it. But since it's local gun violence, that's just "another mass shooting, let's move on".

well, the san bernardino ones were pakistani, not arab, but anyway that's good enough for the police to say they think terrorism might be a factor. the whole thing is bizarre, though, apparently the couple targeted the guy's colleagues first.
Muscles are nonsensical they have nothing to do with this bullshit.

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Raptor

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Re: Another Mass Shooting in the US
« Reply #17 on: December 03, 2015, 03:46:48 pm »
0
And by the way - what's up with legalizing armor-piercing bullets?

adarqui

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Re: Another Mass Shooting in the US
« Reply #18 on: December 03, 2015, 03:59:31 pm »
0
Imagine if some arabs were to do this... the media would be all over it. But since it's local gun violence, that's just "another mass shooting, let's move on".

well, the san bernardino ones were pakistani, not arab, but anyway that's good enough for the police to say they think terrorism might be a factor. the whole thing is bizarre, though, apparently the couple targeted the guy's colleagues first.

there might be a more conclusive link to terrorism though.. fbi saying he might have been radicalized (cnn source):

"Syed Rizwan Farook -- who along with his wife, Tashfeen Malik, carried out the San Bernardino shooting massacre -- apparently was radicalized and in touch with people being investigated by the FBI for international terrorism, law enforcement officials said Thursday"

John Stamos

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Re: Another Mass Shooting in the US
« Reply #19 on: December 03, 2015, 05:20:35 pm »
+2
fuck the NRA. take everyone's guns away. just take 'em away, melt 'em down, and use the metal to rebuild some bridges or some shit. nobody needs a fucking handgun, nobody needs an AR-15. fuck people who think that clinging to their guns is worth 355 mass shootings this year alone, is worth thousands of suicides and accidental deaths every year.

i've shot a few guns. it's a fun activity. by all means, continue to have gun ranges. by all means, people who actually need to or enjoy hunting for recreation, keep your long guns. but you better go through the same fucking level of security that everyone motherfucking refugee trying to get to this country has to go through before they even get an interview at the embassy before you can have that rifle at your house.

If people are determined to kill, even if you take away guns, don't you think they will look towards other means of doing so?  It's not hard to look on the internet to find out how to make a bomb and I remember reading about someone who ran through a hallway and stabbed 20 people.  Also with suicides, if no guns existed, if someone really wants to kill themselves then chances are they will throw themselves off a bridge, hang themselves etc etc.  A few years back about 15 miles from me, a girl managed to use a circular saw to turn herself into a pez dispenser.

I do agree that you should take a better class than what they make you take to get a pistol because unintentional accidents and deaths are caused from stupidity(guns jamming and looking down the barrels, trying to shoot a shotgun with 1 hand etc etc) along with people who are morons that buy guns and don'get a lockable gun cabinet.  Psychological tests are good i guess, not fool proof but might deter the really loony people. (if you've ever taken a psychological exam you'd know what I mean)

I have guns and never had a problem, woulda been nice to have it the few times I had to fight people in syracuse that had knives..well one guy had a meat cleaver.

the thing is, you're wrong. of course some people are going to find other ways to murder other people or commit suicide. the problem with guns is that they make both of those activities much easier and more efficient. sure, maybe ONE person has killed 20 people with a knife, but it's freaking hard to do that -- you have to get right up next to people! and sure a few people have built bombs but that takes time and deliberation. shooting someone you can do literally by accident and it's over in a fraction of a second.

I'm wrong because you agreed with me?  I never said guns didn't make it easier, just the fact that if someone is set on doing harm to people, they will find other ways to do so.  The Anarchist cook book shows how to make bombs effortlessly.  Guns are not the problem here, religion is and I just saw stationary bikes you can put in a pool, thats kind of cool.  Along with yours and Adarqs regulations, why not make more areas open carry?

Monday
.5 mile run warm up, squat, bench, deadlift
Tuesday
1 mile run, xfit
Wednesday
1 mile run, bodyweight day
Thursday
.5 mile run, db/machines
Friday
1 mile run, xfit
Saturday
1 mile run, bodyweight day.

Raptor

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Re: Another Mass Shooting in the US
« Reply #20 on: December 03, 2015, 06:03:10 pm »
+4
Guns are definitely the problem. lol I can't believe we are seriously discussing this.

Guns make it all so easy, you just push a trigger and you're done - there's no physical contact, if you're a coward it's easy even for you. Plus they are CREATED for killing, there's no other use for them - they are killing machines. And killing machines, specifically made for killing, have no place in a civilized society that prides itself on making it as safe as possible.

Not to mention the 2nd amendment is so obsolete and refers to a "well regulated militia", not Joe from the street corner buying himself military-grade equipment.

This is all happening because the gun industry which has a tremendous amount of money can manipulate the media in presenting biased points of view and making gullible (ok, stupid) people buying into the propaganda.

If I can see it from over here in Romania, you should too.

T0ddday

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Re: Another Mass Shooting in the US
« Reply #21 on: December 03, 2015, 08:03:17 pm »
+2
If I can see it from over here in Romania, you should too.

Lol, good point...  Your forgetting that sometimes it's really hard to see stuff happening in your own backyard...

Speaking of close to home...  The shooting wasn't that far from where I work.  I was omw to work when it happened and like 20 police cars passed by going ridiculously fast and swat cars...  We were afraid the hospital was going to get locked down... 

Not that there is anything to cheer for about in mass murder but every time there is a mass shooting and the news quickly comes out that "the assault rifles and tactical gear and bullets" were all purchased 100% legally and the killers hadn't been diagnosed with any psychiatric condition I try to look at it as a positive that people will finally wake up that guns are the problem and some regulation like not letting the insane people by them won't solve it...

Before someone chimes in....  Look, I know guns are not LITERALLY the problem.  I know guns don't walk around and fire themselves.  But by that logic nuclear weapons are no problem at all - it's the crazy people who set them off who are - and we should let every person we deem sane to buy a personal nuclear weapon...   Oh what, you don't want to do that?   Because your afraid one of them might use it?  Well, so am I with guns and they got shot in MY neighborhood so I would rather nobody be able to purchase guns as well...

I just don't get the rationale for guns.  These people who claim to be responsible and have kids and have guns for "protection".  I don't get it.  If you have kids the only rational thing to do is keep your guns unloaded in a lock box...  So, when multiple (armed robbers usually are not alone) criminals break into your house in the middle of the night with a bunch of guns you will be safer because before they can get to you or your kids you think you can wake yourself up out of your dream and crawl to your safe and open it and load your gun and take off the safety and fight them off?   Seriously?  If that's your reason for buying a gun you are insane and therefore shouldn't be able to buy a gun.

The only other rationale I hear for guns is "they are soooooo fun to shoot".  Well I don't know about that I have never shot a gun.  But my first friend in the 3rd grade was shot and killed by one.  In addition to my best friend in the 4th grade.   So I know they do that.   I think a lot of other things are fun.  I think running fast is fun.  But if I knew that every time I ran sub 11 in the 100m that a thousand people were going to die I would gladly give it up.  So if you think you having fun shooting guns is worth thousands of innocent people losing their life then you are so selfish it's criminal and that is also insane...  Since your insane you shouldn't be able to buy a gun.

Since, there really isn't any other reason you need to own a working gun, the rest of us sane people probably won't want to own one.  So do the simplest thing possible and ban the insane people from having guns by getting rid of all of them and making them illegal.  It worked with PCP!   


adarqui

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Re: Another Mass Shooting in the US
« Reply #22 on: December 03, 2015, 10:10:24 pm »
+1
If I can see it from over here in Romania, you should too.

Lol, good point...  Your forgetting that sometimes it's really hard to see stuff happening in your own backyard...

Speaking of close to home...  The shooting wasn't that far from where I work.  I was omw to work when it happened and like 20 police cars passed by going ridiculously fast and swat cars...  We were afraid the hospital was going to get locked down... 

damn!!





On another note.. i'm not really in a big 'gun town'. There's no open carry here for example. Can't even think of a gun range nearby. There's a few pawn shops somewhere. Anyway, every time I checkout at publix (grocery store), I see 6 gun magazines with sniper rifles, assault rifles, tactical gear, desert eagles etc on them. Feels like i'm in a gun store when I see all of those magazines. Young boys have cap guns, water guns, nerf guns, g.i. joes etc. Slightly older kids have extremely realistic war-like/shoot`em up video games. There's violence all over TV and in the movies. Before guns completely disappear, there would need to be a huge culture shift. I don't see that happening any time soon.  Beyond a gun problem, we have a culture problem. This country (USA) is addicted to violence like it's addicted to high fructose corn syrup.



and... this is why nothing gets done:

http://fortune.com/2015/12/03/san-bernadino-nra-political-spending-gun-violence/

"All in all, Volsky found that in 2012 the NRA spent $19.7 million on candidates who tweeted “thoughts and prayers” after the San Bernadino shooting."

I imagine influencing someone as powerful as McConnell is so effective at trickling down to the entire GOP.



pc!

Raptor

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Re: Another Mass Shooting in the US
« Reply #23 on: December 04, 2015, 04:54:05 am »
+1
I must say, I'm very pleasantly surprised by the discussion in here. I remember back in the day when we talked about this and Lance was around, I used to be mocked like crazy when I said something similar to what I said above. So I kinda wanted to stay away from this thread. It's great to see that people's views changed for the better ever since.

Now if only action were to be taken to actually do something about this.

And by the way - until you get money out of politics, the USA will continue to be screwed. That's where all these problems reside. "Donate" (legally bribe) to a politician, make him your bitch, and make him represent you, the donor, not the people who vote him. All his job from then on is to be a good "presenter" for the public that votes him, but after that he will represent your interest, the donor's.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2015, 04:56:41 am by Raptor »

vag

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Re: Another Mass Shooting in the US
« Reply #24 on: December 04, 2015, 05:27:09 am »
+2
^Nothing changed man, we are the same people reading it. You put up a nice argument, without generalizing and derailing and needless aggressive sarcasm, people appreciate it, they thumb it up. Post again shit like 'STFU you bad americans drone killers' and get -7 the next minute. There is no prejudice, it is all about the arguments.
woot

Raptor

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Re: Another Mass Shooting in the US
« Reply #25 on: December 04, 2015, 07:20:54 am »
0
What I mean is - it feels to me that there's a different "mental state" now than back then regarding this subject.

mattyg35

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Re: Another Mass Shooting in the US
« Reply #26 on: December 04, 2015, 09:21:59 am »
-3
At the behest of the NRA, Congress banned the CDC from funding research into the health risks of gun ownership 20 years ago. But before they did that, this paper was published in the NEJM: http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199310073291506

Quote
After controlling for these characteristics, we found that keeping a gun in the home was strongly and independently associated with an increased risk of homicide (adjusted odds ratio, 2.7; 95 percent confidence interval, 1.6 to 4.4). Virtually all of this risk involved homicide by a family member or intimate acquaintance.

Gun crime isn't a disease and therefore the it is not the CDC that should be looking into it. The FBI already does.
December 04, 2015, 09:21:59 am - Hidden. Show this post.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2015, 09:25:04 am by mattyg35 »

LBSS

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Re: Another Mass Shooting in the US
« Reply #27 on: December 04, 2015, 11:29:39 am »
+1
At the behest of the NRA, Congress banned the CDC from funding research into the health risks of gun ownership 20 years ago. But before they did that, this paper was published in the NEJM: http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199310073291506

Quote
After controlling for these characteristics, we found that keeping a gun in the home was strongly and independently associated with an increased risk of homicide (adjusted odds ratio, 2.7; 95 percent confidence interval, 1.6 to 4.4). Virtually all of this risk involved homicide by a family member or intimate acquaintance.

Gun crime isn't a disease and therefore the it is not the CDC that should be looking into it. The FBI already does.

are you seriously right now? the CDC's mission, according to itself, is "to protect America from health, safety and security threats, both foreign and in the U.S." guns are a health, safety, and security threat.
Muscles are nonsensical they have nothing to do with this bullshit.

- Avishek

handstand + backflip + flag

mattyg35

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Re: Another Mass Shooting in the US
« Reply #28 on: December 04, 2015, 12:45:58 pm »
0
 :huh:
At the behest of the NRA, Congress banned the CDC from funding research into the health risks of gun ownership 20 years ago. But before they did that, this paper was published in the NEJM: http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199310073291506

Quote
After controlling for these characteristics, we found that keeping a gun in the home was strongly and independently associated with an increased risk of homicide (adjusted odds ratio, 2.7; 95 percent confidence interval, 1.6 to 4.4). Virtually all of this risk involved homicide by a family member or intimate acquaintance.

Gun crime isn't a disease and therefore the it is not the CDC that should be looking into it. The FBI already does.

are you seriously right now? the CDC's mission, according to itself, is "to protect America from health, safety and security threats, both foreign and in the U.S." guns are a health, safety, and security threat.

Way to omit the next sentence to suit your agenda.
http://www.cdc.gov/about/organization/mission.htm

"Mission

CDC works 24/7 to protect America from health, safety and security threats, both foreign and in the U.S. Whether diseases start at home or abroad, are chronic or acute, curable or preventable, human error or deliberate attack, CDC fights disease and supports communities and citizens to do the same.
"

Furthermore

"CDC in the 21st Century

On the cutting edge of health security – confronting global disease threats through advanced computing and lab analysis of huge amounts of data to quickly find solutions.
Putting science into action – tracking disease and finding out what is making people sick and the most effective ways to prevent it.
Helping medical care – bringing new knowledge to individual health care and community health to save more lives and reduce waste.
Fighting diseases before they reach our borders – detecting and confronting new germs and diseases around the globe to increase our national security.
Nurturing public health - building on our significant contribution to have strong, well-resourced public health leaders and capabilities at national, state and local levels to protect Americans from health threats.
"

T0ddday

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Re: Another Mass Shooting in the US
« Reply #29 on: December 04, 2015, 01:23:13 pm »
0
What I mean is - it feels to me that there's a different "mental state" now than back then regarding this subject.

Well, I hate to take a pessimistic view of things but there have been a couple hundred mass shootings between back then and now...  getting money out of politics would be great but overwhelming shifts in cultural opinion can engender slow change as well...

Thats what happened w gay marriage.  Americans didnt change there mind based on a sense of equality or fairness for even whose choices they didnt respect or found distateful (homosexuals) instead they culturally accepted gay people and they then thought that their friends should now have the right to get married because "hey my kids friend has two dads and they really arent so bad!"

When enough americans are personally affected by gun violence I think the cultural opinion will change... 

Sad that we cant seem to think outside of our own little world about big ideas that effect lots of people...