Author Topic: chasing athleticism  (Read 940415 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Mikey

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3303
  • Respect: +2787
    • View Profile
    • http://www.youtube.com/user/Mutumbo000?feature=mhee
    • Email
Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #2940 on: June 20, 2016, 11:26:03 pm »
+2
Here is a question for you, is there a way to get thse benefits of sprinting out of a single workout. LIke minimal effective dose kinda thing? I'm not trying to become a 32 year old rookie track star lol.

A % of something is better than 100% of nothing so yes I do think you'll get some benefit out of sprinting, even if you only do it once a week.

T0ddday will probably have a different opinion but I think doing something simple, such as
5x100m max effort with full recovery
would be optimal for 1 session a week.

I get sore running on the treadmill but if you find a grass oval that has a track (not sure where you live, but there are generally plenty of these around) it will be easier on your knees as well.
"IMO, It didn't happen if it's not on vid/official"- adarqui

It's easier to keep up than it is to catch up...

AGC

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1623
  • Respect: +1194
    • View Profile
Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #2941 on: June 21, 2016, 12:09:52 am »
+1
Here a rough summary of how my workouts are looking for the coming week:

Mon: off
Tue: Lifts
Wed: off
Thurs: plyos: depth jumps /  jump squats,  full court bball game
Fri: off
sat: Lifts 
Sun: pickup bball

I need to figure out a way to include track work ..
but idk what day wud suit. Maybe thurs? hmmm.

Are you kidding?  Your already doing plyos Thursday. 

Monday.  Tuesday before lifts.  Sat before lifts.  Lots of options.  You gotta change your mindset when it comes to lifting though if you want to become a real athlete. 

The mindset is: "oh no if I sprint/bound/jump before lifting my squat will be weaker!" Unacceptable. 

First of all.  Are you a lifter or an athlete?

Second.  Maybe weaker but actually not much weaker because you will adapt.  Assuming you squat 200kg.  Maybe initially when you get in track work first that squat will go down to 180.  But you will adapt and be able to lift 95% as much post track. 

Third.  Who cares how much you lift.  Progress requires effort moreso than poundage.  So if you doing track and lifting and progressing your squat from 150-160-170kg vs avoiding track and going from 160-170-180 it's the same thing.   A month off track and you would "realize your gains" and squat almost as much as if u never did the track work.   Basically a track work normalized lift doesn't need to be as strong - the carryover is the same and the weight is safer.   Win win.

Ok, i can take these criticism on board. Lemme revamp my program tonight.

Here is what i'm considering

Mon: off
Tue: track, weights
Wed: off
Thu: plyos/dunks, basketball
Fri: off
Sat: weights
sun: pickup bball

I feel i'm not really able to do track twice a week without wrecking my knees tho. i get achy knees just from 10 mins of slow steady treadmill running ffs. lol. but i'll start with the session tuesday, and if i make it work, can addd in the saturday session?

I found that when you get into proper sprinting form the load on the knees becomes fairly minor. It's counterintuitive, I was a little worried about getting patellar tendonitis and all that when I returned to sprinting but it really took a long time for me to get any knee issues, and that was due to too much slower endurance work more than anything. Never had any knee issues when sprinting as a junior either. YMMV if you are also playing ball and doing jumps though so be wary.

maxent

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2830
  • Respect: +2114
    • View Profile
Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #2942 on: June 21, 2016, 01:06:07 am »
+2
If i'm being honest, you guys are right, sprinting is actually not bad on my knees. I did find bounds to be pretty hard though, especially SL ones when i did them. However, sprinting itself on grass didn't do it, running on the TM, even regular TM walking does though! Ok, i'll add in another session.

Mon: off
Tue: track, weights
Wed: off
Thu: plyos/dunks, basketball
Fri: off
Sat: track, weights
sun: pickup bball

Does that look ok? Hope i'm not biting off more than i can chew, i want a program i can stick to for 12 weeks without breaking
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

adarqui

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 34034
  • who run it.
  • Respect: +9111
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #2943 on: June 21, 2016, 01:32:39 am »
0
If i'm being honest, you guys are right, sprinting is actually not bad on my knees. I did find bounds to be pretty hard though, especially SL ones when i did them. However, sprinting itself on grass didn't do it, running on the TM, even regular TM walking does though! Ok, i'll add in another session.

Mon: off
Tue: track, weights
Wed: off
Thu: plyos/dunks, basketball
Fri: off
Sat: track, weights
sun: pickup bball

Does that look ok? Hope i'm not biting off more than i can chew, i want a program i can stick to for 12 weeks without breaking

nice.. go4it. 3-rest-days ftw.. now it just depends on what you do in those sessions, but regardless, you can push yourself nicely with that schedule while still getting enough recovery.

 :highfive:

maxent

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2830
  • Respect: +2114
    • View Profile
chasing athleticism (Day 1 of the new track focus training)
« Reply #2944 on: June 21, 2016, 06:14:31 am »
0
BW: 177.91lb / 80.7kg

Sprints, 3x130m (i think) with 25s recovery), 1x130m (with full recovery; ME, )
BS 3x6x110kg (LPR)
OHP 3x6x55(LPR)
CURL 3x6x42.5(LPR)

Notes:
thought bout doing bounds but decided against it, lemme focus on sprints for a minute .. then i'll add in assistance like bounds? idk. For lifting, notably, switched out old bar for new bar, it's slightly heavier at 20kg vs 19.something. I'm going to make short work of getting my squat workouts to sets of 6x120kg .. maybe even 6x125kg but i do think 6x130kg while having a clear sixpack and playing bball regularly is a decent end goal .. if i can get all these things at the same time in 8-12 weeks, i'm doing great. Esp without creatine.
« Last Edit: June 21, 2016, 07:01:37 am by maxent »
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

FP

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 909
  • Respect: +777
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #2945 on: June 21, 2016, 10:41:12 am »
0
I'm going to lay off the low carb dieting now and do it in a more moderate fashion from here on. I want to stabilise at 174 with creatine -- so i think i need to make room for bout 2.5lb before I add in creatine? SOmething like that. I dont know.

Esp without creatine.

So did you decide not to use creatine at all? Any reason why?

T0ddday

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1343
  • Respect: +1114
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: chasing athleticism (Day 1 of the new track focus training)
« Reply #2946 on: June 21, 2016, 11:13:04 am »
+3
BW: 177.91lb / 80.7kg

Sprints, 3x130m (i think) with 25s recovery), 1x130m (with full recovery; ME, )
BS 3x6x110kg (LPR)
OHP 3x6x55(LPR)
CURL 3x6x42.5(LPR)

Notes:
thought bout doing bounds but decided against it, lemme focus on sprints for a minute .. then i'll add in assistance like bounds? idk. For lifting, notably, switched out old bar for new bar, it's slightly heavier at 20kg vs 19.something. I'm going to make short work of getting my squat workouts to sets of 6x120kg .. maybe even 6x125kg but i do think 6x130kg while having a clear sixpack and playing bball regularly is a decent end goal .. if i can get all these things at the same time in 8-12 weeks, i'm doing great. Esp without creatine.

A couple things.  I don't disagree too much with Mutumbos suggestion of doing something like 5x100 ME once a week being a good workout, except keep the following in mind:

#1) Keep your distances shorter rather than longer...  I think your comment that you are not trying to become a competitive track star is VERY salient... So leave out the workouts that are necessary for becoming a track star that also are harder on the body.  These would be the longer ME runs.  Longer runs 100m - 300m at ME are going to be harder on your body and not really necessary if you don't need to compete.  For me as a sprinter competing seriously in the 60m, 100m, and 200m (somewhat seriously in the 200m cause I was never good at it) I had to do a lot of 150m-300m speed endurance work which is hard on my body but really only extremely necessary for about the last 60m in the 200m (which you don't need). 

Acole is right but also realize that "proper sprinting form" for you (and most of us) isn't really possible as we fatigue (and we do fatigue after 10 seconds).

So for you I would include more short sprints.  Something like 5x20m, 4x40, 3x60, 2x80, 1x100m.  Is a good workout for you and shouldn't be hard on your knees.  I don't know why you picked 130m sprints but IMO it's those last 50m in a 130m that could be a bit tough on your knees.  I'm not anti longer than 100m sprints (we have NBA guys doing an absolute maximum distance of 150m and those are not ME - 100m is the maximum ME distance), but if you include 100m-200m sprints keep them proper form by keeping intensity down...

Also, consider hill sprints.  I like the idea of 2x per week - once on track/grass once on hills.  Hill work is VERY easy on knees.

#2) Bounding.  Bounding is great.  But you are right that it's hard on your body - especially what you showed us on video - ME broad jumps on bball court.  I wouldn't drop bounding  - I would just look at it differently.  I would keep at as part of your warmup.  I would keep it like this:

Workout:
1) 3-5 strides
2) 3-5 50m mobility runs to get warm
3) 5 30m dynamic walking stretches (knee to elbow lunge, hand to heel lunge, inchworm hamstring to handstand stretch, walking leg kicks, walking hip stretch holds, etc. 
4) 3-5 10yard Locked knee ankle bounds to get warmer
5)  Bounding:

a) 10 broad jumps (EASY - if you have yard markers and you max Broad jump is 3 yards you could just do 10 jumps that are over 10 yards. Jump reset. Jump reset, etc).
b) Multi Bounds - EASY.  Again so imagine your best 5xbunny hop is 15 yards.  So just hit 12 three times with good form.  Same for single leg and alternating leg.  After weeks of this you can add a yard.  But there are not attempts to PR necessarily (when you are feeling great I am sure you will be tempted to - but think of these as submax bounds which WILL help your vertical jump and dynamic basketball jumping and get your warm).

6) Sprint workout.
7) Stretch/Cooldown

#3) Program REST.  Like Adarq said about your CNS - you gotta watch it.  But one thing people forget is that it's OK to have a program that will fry your CNS after weeks and weeks of it.  In fact I think that's the optimal program.  You should have a program that if you did it for 15 weeks straight you will be fried.  Just don't do it for 15 weeks.  Think in blocks of minumum 3 weeks, maximum of 6 weeks.  So you have your weights, bball, jumping, track bounding that you do...  Week 1, Week 2, Week 3.   Do the submax bounds and maybe during Week 3 you allow yourself to really go all out on 1 set of each (5x multi-bound, 5x multi-single leg and alternating leg bound).  Get a PR.   Then week 4 is OFF.  If you don't want to take it off the good thing about sprinting is it's REALLY easy to deload.  You can do your bounds only with straight legs to just get blood moving.  If you have been doing 5x100m in 13 seconds you just back this off to 5x100m in 16 seconds and it becomes recovery and easy rather than damaging...

Programming REST weeks or deloading weeks into your schedule is far better than trying to program a workout that isn't too hard on your CNS.  IMO it's better to go 105%, 105%, 110%, 60% every four weeks rather than 95%, 95% 95%, 95%.   You will make better gains AND honestly 95% is too close for comfort for me...  Depending on life, work, stress (with your women sounds like you got that) you might do what you think is 95% but you are actually doing 101%, 101%, 101%, 101% and like Andrew said - this WILL catch up with you and you will stagnate, get worse, get angry and worst of all get injured.  We know what 60% is.   We hate it as athletes.  But as long as you go hard the previous three weeks think of it as just as important and also well deserved...

adarqui

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 34034
  • who run it.
  • Respect: +9111
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: chasing athleticism (Day 1 of the new track focus training)
« Reply #2947 on: June 21, 2016, 02:46:08 pm »
+1
#3) Program REST.  Like Adarq said about your CNS - you gotta watch it.  But one thing people forget is that it's OK to have a program that will fry your CNS after weeks and weeks of it.  In fact I think that's the optimal program.  You should have a program that if you did it for 15 weeks straight you will be fried.  Just don't do it for 15 weeks.  Think in blocks of minumum 3 weeks, maximum of 6 weeks.  So you have your weights, bball, jumping, track bounding that you do...  Week 1, Week 2, Week 3.   Do the submax bounds and maybe during Week 3 you allow yourself to really go all out on 1 set of each (5x multi-bound, 5x multi-single leg and alternating leg bound).  Get a PR.   Then week 4 is OFF.  If you don't want to take it off the good thing about sprinting is it's REALLY easy to deload.  You can do your bounds only with straight legs to just get blood moving.  If you have been doing 5x100m in 13 seconds you just back this off to 5x100m in 16 seconds and it becomes recovery and easy rather than damaging...

Programming REST weeks or deloading weeks into your schedule is far better than trying to program a workout that isn't too hard on your CNS.  IMO it's better to go 105%, 105%, 110%, 60% every four weeks rather than 95%, 95% 95%, 95%.   You will make better gains AND honestly 95% is too close for comfort for me...  Depending on life, work, stress (with your women sounds like you got that) you might do what you think is 95% but you are actually doing 101%, 101%, 101%, 101% and like Andrew said - this WILL catch up with you and you will stagnate, get worse, get angry and worst of all get injured.  We know what 60% is.   We hate it as athletes.  But as long as you go hard the previous three weeks think of it as just as important and also well deserved...

very nice! love this.

maxent

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2830
  • Respect: +2114
    • View Profile
Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #2948 on: June 21, 2016, 08:21:27 pm »
0
I'm going to lay off the low carb dieting now and do it in a more moderate fashion from here on. I want to stabilise at 174 with creatine -- so i think i need to make room for bout 2.5lb before I add in creatine? SOmething like that. I dont know.

Esp without creatine.

So did you decide not to use creatine at all? Any reason why?

I just wanna get to PR territory while weighing <80kg, so i can add in creatine there and go further. Makes it harder now but possible to break some mental/physical barriers later down the track. Otherwise i think creatine is really good, makes you train harder and recover better etc. Thanks for stopping by!
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

maxent

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2830
  • Respect: +2114
    • View Profile
Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #2949 on: June 23, 2016, 02:13:37 am »
+1
BW:80.1kg / 176.59lb (LPR)

Ok so this is the lowest ive weighed since coming home. But ive been eating like shit lately. hotdogs, meatballs, loads of chips/fries and last night m&ms. I think ive been grieving the end of a promising relationship even before it blossomed. She went MIA since the weekend and she hasnt been returning my messages. I take the writing on the wall for what it is, occam's razor doesn't permit any other interpretation at this juncture. I knida know that im not going to find someone else like her unless i leave this city for greener pastures. So it's loss in the sense of what it means in the long term. I am going to end it with the younger girl too, i dont want to lead her on, theres no future there, 9 years is a huge gap. So yeah single again. Time to turn to training to fill the void. I'm back on the chicken breast and oatmeal wagon as of today!

Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

T0ddday

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1343
  • Respect: +1114
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #2950 on: June 23, 2016, 02:35:00 am »
+5
BW:80.1kg / 176.59lb (LPR)

Ok so this is the lowest ive weighed since coming home. But ive been eating like shit lately. hotdogs, meatballs, loads of chips/fries and last night m&ms. I think ive been grieving the end of a promising relationship even before it blossomed. She went MIA since the weekend and she hasnt been returning my messages. I take the writing on the wall for what it is, occam's razor doesn't permit any other interpretation at this juncture. I knida know that im not going to find someone else like her unless i leave this city for greener pastures. So it's loss in the sense of what it means in the long term. I am going to end it with the younger girl too, i dont want to lead her on, theres no future there, 9 years is a huge gap. So yeah single again. Time to turn to training to fill the void. I'm back on the chicken breast and oatmeal wagon as of today!

Occam's razor is proof of nothing and even still it is useful only for matters regarding models of the physical world. 

Occam's razor should never be applied for matters of the heart.  She hasn't returned a few texts.  Don't harass her or send her any fatalistic or final text about how she hasn't returned them and thus you assume the worst.   But do assume something.  Assume something that puts you both in an extremely positive light and leave it alone without finality in your head...

Assume that you are awesome and she saw that and she is awesome as well... But she is going through something or perhaps is a little apprehensive about meeting a man so amazing...  Believe this.  She might not text you ever again... But then again maybe she will... And when she does you need to be the positive and optimistic guy she met - this can't be faked.   Don't burn bridges.  Don't put this on your shortcomings or her failings as far as not being respectful and getting back to you... If she 100% didn't like you she probably would have told you rather than disappeared in fear... Be you and post great IG stuff of dunks and believe something positive and you will be surprised how it pays off... 

This advice was given when I was young and was life changing for me... Had to share it with you.  Do with it what u want...

Mikey

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3303
  • Respect: +2787
    • View Profile
    • http://www.youtube.com/user/Mutumbo000?feature=mhee
    • Email
Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #2951 on: June 23, 2016, 03:19:40 am »
0
BW:80.1kg / 176.59lb (LPR)

Ok so this is the lowest ive weighed since coming home. But ive been eating like shit lately. hotdogs, meatballs, loads of chips/fries and last night m&ms. I think ive been grieving the end of a promising relationship even before it blossomed. She went MIA since the weekend and she hasnt been returning my messages. I take the writing on the wall for what it is, occam's razor doesn't permit any other interpretation at this juncture. I knida know that im not going to find someone else like her unless i leave this city for greener pastures. So it's loss in the sense of what it means in the long term. I am going to end it with the younger girl too, i dont want to lead her on, theres no future there, 9 years is a huge gap. So yeah single again. Time to turn to training to fill the void. I'm back on the chicken breast and oatmeal wagon as of today!

Sorry it didn't work out. 

Props for your attitude though. Straight back into training instead of moping around feeling sorry for yourself. You'll find the right lady.
"IMO, It didn't happen if it's not on vid/official"- adarqui

It's easier to keep up than it is to catch up...

maxent

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2830
  • Respect: +2114
    • View Profile
Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #2952 on: June 23, 2016, 09:35:27 am »
+2
BW:80.1kg / 176.59lb (LPR)

Ok so this is the lowest ive weighed since coming home. But ive been eating like shit lately. hotdogs, meatballs, loads of chips/fries and last night m&ms. I think ive been grieving the end of a promising relationship even before it blossomed. She went MIA since the weekend and she hasnt been returning my messages. I take the writing on the wall for what it is, occam's razor doesn't permit any other interpretation at this juncture. I knida know that im not going to find someone else like her unless i leave this city for greener pastures. So it's loss in the sense of what it means in the long term. I am going to end it with the younger girl too, i dont want to lead her on, theres no future there, 9 years is a huge gap. So yeah single again. Time to turn to training to fill the void. I'm back on the chicken breast and oatmeal wagon as of today!

Occam's razor is proof of nothing and even still it is useful only for matters regarding models of the physical world. 

Occam's razor should never be applied for matters of the heart.  She hasn't returned a few texts.  Don't harass her or send her any fatalistic or final text about how she hasn't returned them and thus you assume the worst.   But do assume something.  Assume something that puts you both in an extremely positive light and leave it alone without finality in your head...

Assume that you are awesome and she saw that and she is awesome as well... But she is going through something or perhaps is a little apprehensive about meeting a man so amazing...  Believe this.  She might not text you ever again... But then again maybe she will... And when she does you need to be the positive and optimistic guy she met - this can't be faked.   Don't burn bridges.  Don't put this on your shortcomings or her failings as far as not being respectful and getting back to you... If she 100% didn't like you she probably would have told you rather than disappeared in fear... Be you and post great IG stuff of dunks and believe something positive and you will be surprised how it pays off... 

This advice was given when I was young and was life changing for me... Had to share it with you.  Do with it what u want...

This was exactly what I needed to hear. I don't even have to assume too much, it's pretty much true as is. Pretty amazing how a perspective can change a situation radically. Wow.
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

maxent

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2830
  • Respect: +2114
    • View Profile
Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #2953 on: June 23, 2016, 09:40:06 am »
+3
Nailed Day 1, drank a protein shake for meal 1. Meal 2 was peri-workout 500mL gatorade. Meal 3: 1 chicken breast, shake, 4 x steamed chicken bbq buns and some sweet potato for extra carb for sleep quality.

Played bball, didn't get a call out to fill in but got a pretty competitive set of 3 pickup games. Some dunks, bout 18 total. I dunk a lot better around other ppl. When they left and i was by myself i didnt have the juice to do it, may be nutrition related too. I'm not far from PR territory .. which is surpising so soon.. but then again im not in danger of getting a PR of 40" so there's that also..

looking forward to resting tmr and then saturday ... track and weights.. weirdly looking forward to training for once.. i think i'm liking the things sprinting is doing to my body comp .. the gut i had is virtually disappearing overnight .. i'm still fat but getting lean quick.. nice..
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

maxent

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2830
  • Respect: +2114
    • View Profile
Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #2954 on: June 26, 2016, 01:25:22 am »
0
BS 2x120(LPR), 3x120(LPR), 4x2x120(LPR)
RDL 12x110(LPR), 10x150 (LPR)
BP 5x80(LPR)

BW: 80.7kg

Notes:
Decided to man up and start squatting heavy. Was pretty tough, struggled with almost every rep. Wanted to do a few more triples but noped out when i thought i may fail the 3rds. Incomplete workout. Was supposed to do chinups and more bench volume and also track work not to mnention dips in the park. Had to cut hte workout short cos i had to go out to a wedding function in the evening. Will try to do the remaining stuff next day..
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template