Author Topic: chasing athleticism  (Read 940580 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

maxent

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2830
  • Respect: +2114
    • View Profile
Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #3570 on: March 13, 2017, 04:47:27 am »
+1
Sorry coges, i never got around to replying to your post. But here is an outline of what im tryna do:

To be a lean 85kg first be a lean 80kg. To be a lean 80kg first be a lean 75kg. To be a lean 75kg first be a ...?  Somewhere along the way i'll find myself a lean 'something kg' to stop cutting. Then maintain bf% a while to create a new bf% setpoint. Finally start working up patiently towards a lean 85kg. The initial cutting process may go on for a while, possibly needing to weigh as low as 70.0kg (carb depleted) but once it's done im not forever-cutting anymore.

The milestones i'm looking for in order are:

1) lean upper body & upper back (not there yet)
2) lean abdominals  (neither)
3) lean lower back  (not even close)
4) lean lower body (far away)

I haven't even reached the first step yet :/ From experience I could get to around 2.5ish by cutting to <72.5kg - but that was with creatine but at that point i had no fat on my upper back by the jiggle test. I never reached 3 and 4 but that's where I wanna be, lean lower back gets me 'lean enough' though for my purposes, not sure I would keep going to 4 tbh.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2017, 10:57:21 am by maxent »
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

Coges

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3107
  • Respect: +2267
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #3571 on: March 13, 2017, 11:24:36 pm »
+1
Sorry coges, i never got around to replying to your post. But here is an outline of what im tryna do:

To be a lean 85kg first be a lean 80kg. To be a lean 80kg first be a lean 75kg. To be a lean 75kg first be a ...?  Somewhere along the way i'll find myself a lean 'something kg' to stop cutting. Then maintain bf% a while to create a new bf% setpoint. Finally start working up patiently towards a lean 85kg. The initial cutting process may go on for a while, possibly needing to weigh as low as 70.0kg (carb depleted) but once it's done im not forever-cutting anymore.

The milestones i'm looking for in order are:

1) lean upper body & upper back (not there yet)
2) lean abdominals  (neither)
3) lean lower back  (not even close)
4) lean lower body (far away)

I haven't even reached the first step yet :/ From experience I could get to around 2.5ish by cutting to <72.5kg - but that was with creatine but at that point i had no fat on my upper back by the jiggle test. I never reached 3 and 4 but that's where I wanna be, lean lower back gets me 'lean enough' though for my purposes, not sure I would keep going to 4 tbh.

I understand where you're coming from mate. I do think there's a disconnect between your goals and your behaviours but that's just my 2c. You're super determined though I'll give you that.
"Train as hard as possible, as often as possible, while staying as fresh as possible"
- Zatsiorsky

Kingfish

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2158
  • Respect: +1497
    • View Profile
Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #3572 on: March 13, 2017, 11:59:43 pm »
+4
lean 75kg at 6'4.. what is this.. bone and skin?

you need some more muscle mass buddy. it also helps you burn calories faster. good luck.
5'10" | 210lbs | 39 yrs
reach - 7'8" (92") |paused full squat - 545x1| standing VJ - 40"|

absolute unit

Daily Squats Day 1 - Aug 30, 2011 and still going.

maxent

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2830
  • Respect: +2114
    • View Profile
Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #3573 on: March 14, 2017, 02:13:09 am »
0
Sorry coges, i never got around to replying to your post. But here is an outline of what im tryna do:

To be a lean 85kg first be a lean 80kg. To be a lean 80kg first be a lean 75kg. To be a lean 75kg first be a ...?  Somewhere along the way i'll find myself a lean 'something kg' to stop cutting. Then maintain bf% a while to create a new bf% setpoint. Finally start working up patiently towards a lean 85kg. The initial cutting process may go on for a while, possibly needing to weigh as low as 70.0kg (carb depleted) but once it's done im not forever-cutting anymore.

The milestones i'm looking for in order are:

1) lean upper body & upper back (not there yet)
2) lean abdominals  (neither)
3) lean lower back  (not even close)
4) lean lower body (far away)

I haven't even reached the first step yet :/ From experience I could get to around 2.5ish by cutting to <72.5kg - but that was with creatine but at that point i had no fat on my upper back by the jiggle test. I never reached 3 and 4 but that's where I wanna be, lean lower back gets me 'lean enough' though for my purposes, not sure I would keep going to 4 tbh.

I understand where you're coming from mate. I do think there's a disconnect between your goals and your behaviours but that's just my 2c. You're super determined though I'll give you that.

There is no understanding it mate, it's not up for reason or logic. When i come off these cuts my body fights back super hard and tries to pile the weight back asap. I can't even pretend that it's something i can deal with, im not sure it's in me, just hormones overruling everything. If cutting is hard, coming off the cut without undoing everything is 1000x harder :/ This coming diet break i'm going to need a solid plan to get through it without failing
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

maxent

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2830
  • Respect: +2114
    • View Profile
Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #3574 on: March 14, 2017, 02:15:16 am »
0
lean 75kg at 6'4.. what is this.. bone and skin?

you need some more muscle mass buddy. it also helps you burn calories faster. good luck.

pretty much nailed it. the extra fat i have above 75kg just fills me out to look more human but otherwise im the same person underneath lol. if i accept this state of affairs it means i have to figure out a way to burn more calories with less muscle mass, otherwise my maintenance requirements are low, eg like 1700-1900kcal a day. Maybe cardio always has to be a feature of my training to make up for the shitty genetics whether im trying to gain mass or not
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

maxent

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2830
  • Respect: +2114
    • View Profile
Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #3575 on: March 14, 2017, 02:22:51 am »
0
The biggest looming problems ahead are a)staying lean once i become lean via diet, and b)dealing with low calorie intakes as a long term necessity while im so light/lean. The source of these is the diff between someone naturally lean (Any of the naturally athletic dudes on this site, eg mutumbo/kf/acole/lbss/coges_ vs someone dieted down (ie just me). Someone naturally lean doesn't have the problems I do of having the appetite & hormones of an obese person while being 6'4" & lean 75kg (hopefully not even lean 75kg yet lol). Suppose i achieve that, then maybe loads of drugs to get up to 85kg without being fat. B/c im not sure i can overfeed with my hormonal profile without just getting fat. Never really done a CLEAN BULK tho, or one with good amounts of cardio; but that's a solution im not sure i can manage again with my profile..
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

maxent

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2830
  • Respect: +2114
    • View Profile
Re: chasing athleticism (day #3/10) -- yet another comeback
« Reply #3576 on: March 14, 2017, 02:50:14 am »
0
Bodyweight: 76kg
Activity: ~3k + unknown units while balling (they made me take off my band :( during games)

Training today. I might play a game tonight but it's against a good team with no sub, and im not sure it's a good idea .. so lemme think..

BS 1x120kg(paused), 5x90(paused)
OHP 2x57, 3x2x57.5, 2x57, 1Fx57
Game

done. prob played one of my best games yet .. i was getting mad assists .. felt great. havent i told yall im a big point guard? bout time the world came around to the idea :P
« Last Edit: March 14, 2017, 02:14:52 pm by maxent »
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

Kingfish

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2158
  • Respect: +1497
    • View Profile
Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #3577 on: March 14, 2017, 08:28:37 am »
+4
The biggest looming problems ahead are a)staying lean once i become lean via diet, and b)dealing with low calorie intakes as a long term necessity while im so light/lean. The source of these is the diff between someone naturally lean (Any of the naturally athletic dudes on this site, eg mutumbo/kf/acole/lbss/coges_ vs someone dieted down (ie just me). Someone naturally lean doesn't have the problems I do of having the appetite & hormones of an obese person while being 6'4" & lean 75kg (hopefully not even lean 75kg yet lol). Suppose i achieve that, then maybe loads of drugs to get up to 85kg without being fat. B/c im not sure i can overfeed with my hormonal profile without just getting fat. Never really done a CLEAN BULK tho, or one with good amounts of cardio; but that's a solution im not sure i can manage again with my profile..

unless you have taken a full blood test to prove your wacked hormonal profile, i believe the stress of dieting is just making you mental.  :D

relax.

5'10" | 210lbs | 39 yrs
reach - 7'8" (92") |paused full squat - 545x1| standing VJ - 40"|

absolute unit

Daily Squats Day 1 - Aug 30, 2011 and still going.

maxent

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2830
  • Respect: +2114
    • View Profile
Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #3578 on: March 15, 2017, 02:50:06 am »
0
The biggest looming problems ahead are a)staying lean once i become lean via diet, and b)dealing with low calorie intakes as a long term necessity while im so light/lean. The source of these is the diff between someone naturally lean (Any of the naturally athletic dudes on this site, eg mutumbo/kf/acole/lbss/coges_ vs someone dieted down (ie just me). Someone naturally lean doesn't have the problems I do of having the appetite & hormones of an obese person while being 6'4" & lean 75kg (hopefully not even lean 75kg yet lol). Suppose i achieve that, then maybe loads of drugs to get up to 85kg without being fat. B/c im not sure i can overfeed with my hormonal profile without just getting fat. Never really done a CLEAN BULK tho, or one with good amounts of cardio; but that's a solution im not sure i can manage again with my profile..

unless you have taken a full blood test to prove your wacked hormonal profile, i believe the stress of dieting is just making you mental.  :D

relax.

i want to believe dedication and discipline is enough to overcome it .. because that's our common credos but i have to confess it's not that simple in practice bc when i start overfeeding, its hard to stick to that 500kcal surplus a day solely from oatmeal, for 6 months straight or whatever. Now it sounds like im making excuses but you guys dno .. it's hard man :) i need to try it though. plus do cardio to keep fat loss to a min.
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

maxent

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2830
  • Respect: +2114
    • View Profile
Re: chasing athleticism (day #4/10) -- yet another comeback
« Reply #3579 on: March 15, 2017, 02:54:05 am »
+1
Bodyweight: 74.95kg (PR; finally broke the 75kg milestone)
Activity: 8200 (2325)

It seems playing basketball does make me shed water weight but now im thinking it's prob cos basketball serves to deplete glycogen reserves for me. I thought straight up 20-24hr fasts with zero carb meals for 2 days and 2 nights would do the trick but my body doesn't seem to burn carbs like that for no reason, good to know. ALso means if i wanna PED my basketball, i shud be well fed in carbs pre/peri game. Which i knew from experience but this is additional proof. So 7 days to go, ima do this perfectly and hopefully get lean enough that i dont have to do more dieting..
« Last Edit: March 15, 2017, 11:25:44 am by maxent »
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

maxent

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2830
  • Respect: +2114
    • View Profile
Re: chasing athleticism (day #5/10) -- yet another comeback
« Reply #3580 on: March 15, 2017, 11:55:24 pm »
0
Bodyweight: 74.8kg(PR)
Activity: 7400

Seems to be holding steady below 75kg. W/ hydration, weight vest (5kg) & clothes i'm 81.5kg, haven't needed to increase loading yet. Game tonight..
BS 0Fx125(paused), 1x122.5(LPR), 3x100(paused; LPR?), 5x97.5(LPR)
Game

Notes:
Haven't been lifting thursdays but i thought i should try squatting heavy just to see. I reckon if I wasnt fasted i cud prob have got that 125kg tbh.
game was ... awful. we played down to the opponent, ended with the lead for the first time in the last coupla seconds and of course we couldnt hold on to the ball and they drew the match. lmfao. i didnt get involved in the offense as much which didn't really motivate me much but i still dont think i played well. 
« Last Edit: March 16, 2017, 10:49:37 am by maxent »
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

Mikey

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3303
  • Respect: +2787
    • View Profile
    • http://www.youtube.com/user/Mutumbo000?feature=mhee
    • Email
Re: chasing athleticism (day #5/10) -- yet another comeback
« Reply #3581 on: March 16, 2017, 07:53:58 pm »
0
Bodyweight: 74.8kg(PR)
Activity: 7400

Seems to be holding steady below 75kg. W/ hydration, weight vest (5kg) & clothes i'm 81.5kg, haven't needed to increase loading yet. Game tonight..
BS 0Fx125(paused), 1x122.5(LPR), 3x100(paused; LPR?), 5x97.5(LPR)
Game

Notes:
Haven't been lifting thursdays but i thought i should try squatting heavy just to see. I reckon if I wasnt fasted i cud prob have got that 125kg tbh.
game was ... awful. we played down to the opponent, ended with the lead for the first time in the last coupla seconds and of course we couldnt hold on to the ball and they drew the match. lmfao. i didnt get involved in the offense as much which didn't really motivate me much but i still dont think i played well.

Why not?
Were you in the wrong positions to receive it or were you not demanding it?

I get the lifting though. I try and avoid eating on an empty stomach. The only thing worse then eating on an empty stomach is lifting after you've eaten too much and don't have the time to digest.
"IMO, It didn't happen if it's not on vid/official"- adarqui

It's easier to keep up than it is to catch up...

maxent

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2830
  • Respect: +2114
    • View Profile
Re: chasing athleticism (day #5/10) -- yet another comeback
« Reply #3582 on: March 17, 2017, 02:10:30 am »
0
Why not?
Were you in the wrong positions to receive it or were you not demanding it?

It was like I was a step behind on each play. When I cut, it wasnt noticed but i made the right plays when I had the ball. A few times where I would have got assists the player didnt finish. I find I feed off energy from playing well offensively on the other end too. Maybe it was just luck but there werent many rebounds b/c i wasnt in the right place for them. I think the game was just anomalous.

Quote
I get the lifting though. I try and avoid eating on an empty stomach. The only thing worse then eating on an empty stomach is lifting after you've eaten too much and don't have the time to digest.
I'm def making life harder for me training wise by doing fasting on training days. Dont see that a long term issue tho, this is just while cutting but it affects my performance. A meal 3 hrs before seems to be my sweet spot. And best is when i eat the first meal earlier in the day and then lift later in the afternoon, that's not something ive experienced in a while.
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

maxent

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2830
  • Respect: +2114
    • View Profile
Re: chasing athleticism (day #6/10) -- yet another comeback
« Reply #3583 on: March 17, 2017, 02:15:26 am »
0
Bodyweight: 74.6kg (PR)
Activity:

I updated my sig with the game plan. Any thoughts? If I want to be lifting 120kg for warmups/paused worksets/anyday anytime/etc (as a new strength setpoint), I think it's time to start progressing towards it from my current setpoint of 110kg. So tmr, I have to choose what a bump to take, 112.5kg or 115kg? Not sure, feel 112.5kg is a given, 115kg would be challenging tho but it makes sense.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2017, 02:17:09 am by maxent »
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

maxent

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2830
  • Respect: +2114
    • View Profile
Re: chasing athleticism (day #7/14) -- yet another comeback
« Reply #3584 on: March 18, 2017, 03:29:15 am »
0
Bodyweight: 74.5kg(PR)
Activity: 8810 (2359)

Wow scale really lagging on that weight loss tho. But i know one of these days it will drop overnight smh. Anyways, training today. Volume on squats, back xtn and bench then finish with cardio. I checked out a sweet gym today, im hoping to start next wk. They got everything I need and i can use my Nike Romaloes there which i havent touched since i put them away a few years ago cos my home gym floor would ruin the sole. But now im sold on solid paused squats done perfectly, this will help.

BS 3x115(LPR; p1), 2x3x112.5(PR), 1x3x111, 2x3x110
BP 1x89.5(LPR), 8x72.5(LPR), 7x80
Back Xtn 8x55(PR; 35 deg w/ plates only), 2x12x55(PR; 35 deg, plates & vest), 12x30(PR; 0 deg, vest & plate)
CND - 1km @ 10km/hr

Notes:
In hindsight i wish i had done some more squat volume but i must confess each set of triples was like a 3RM, so i was pretty torched for squatting by the end and didn't wanna court injury, esp in the dark without having a reflection to check my form.

BP my warmup with 50kg felt real nice and then 70kg warmup was a struggle but i somehow did the slowest hardest lockout on the 89.5kg lolz. might be a PR (relative bw ratio?) but who cares about such light weight so im not even gna bother looking it up. Have to keep grinding.

Back xtn, i dropped 3 plates on the first set, decided to vest up for the next 2 sets. I was sliding down the bench tho on the 35 deg, so i think that's one downside compared to the 45 deg where your feet are locked firmly in place by the foot rest. SO ya, i thought to try 0 degree, which is the most challenging but it also has the benefit that you wont slide (being horizontal). SO i think i will prob use 45 deg and 0 deg from here on, though i havent done 45s in a while now.

And cardio was a casualty from that lifting sesh, i forced myself not to skip but a couple of minutes in and i knew there was no way iwas getting 3km (~15 mins) and not only that but even 10 minutes seemed too much so i did 1km (~6mins) and said that'll do for now. Making it a habit never to skip cardio, it's basically low level plyos and so beneficial for athleticism, i wish i never neglected it but i bought into all the bs against it. Never again.


Nutrition:

Make a last second decision to go harder in the gym but allow myself a mini-refeed and extend the diet out to 14 days. Additionally i wont do that 7 day cut cycle i was gna do after the short (7 day) diet break. Think doing that would be counterproductive esp since i have that big bball weekend comp mid April and im running out of time to get myself in peak form. I will prob benefit from going into the comp without cutting for the first time in recent memory. Will post more on this though!!

This is what I ate extra on top of my usual daily intake:
30g carb from gatorade
30g of whey
1 cup rice, 1 cup rajma beans
2 tortillas (mission lowfat ones - 72g carb total)
1 slice light swiss cheese
1 teaspoon light sour cream

Done, that was pretty satisfying. I considered having a bedtime snack of PB&J sandwiches with the shake but decided against it cos i know i prob wont be satisfied with 2 slices and i was already around 190g of carb for the day so that's enough really. Now I shud look forward to some rebound gains .. woohoo.
« Last Edit: March 18, 2017, 02:32:51 pm by maxent »
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template