Performance Area > Strength, Power, Reactivity, & Speed Discussion
basketball conditioning
ChrisM:
This explains why I felt like dying the other day 😂
Agree with Andrew though thoroughly in regards to aerobic distance running having a negative correlation to the start>stop>start environment of a competitive game. I was told (incorrectly) to run cross country to help build a better stamina base for basketball at the end of my freshman year. I got really good at running steady for a 5k. And sucked ass in spring practice. It took the entire summer to get my explosive tendency back and, this is unquantifiable data, I felt LESS tired in the 4th quarter than when I was running distance. I bro science it towards wiring my body to explode consistently vs training it in slow, steady states. Just my uneducated pennies
maxent:
I was going to make a thread on conditioning for basketball and found out i already made one 6 months ago :wowthatwasnutswtf:. Literally have never been fit in my whole life and i was seduced by the idea that just playing basketball was enough to 'build endurance' for basketball. Or running some intervals lol. Probably never played that much full court basketball in any case but even when i did regularly albeit infrequently (1-2x week) i would always redline very quickly into a competive game. I'm talking about seconds into the game, probably because my adrenaline gets jacked way up and my HR maxes out almost immediately. Never figured it out but the demands on conditioning are pretty high and i don't think just 'playing ball' is a good way to train for that conditioning. Which means to me, somehow, people who do play basketball regularly and do so in good condition for the sport must have developed the fitness in a way I missed out. Maybe it was high school training which probably involved a steady diet of suicides or long steady jogs etc etc which i never did because i didn't play basketball in school.
Which brings me to the question of how do you build (basketball) fitness in someone who doesn't have it? From what ive read in studies, there are non-responders to exercise out there which turns out means only that these people need to train more (harder and longer and more often) than responders. If i consider i am a non-responder then my current approach has been (and nothing planned about it, just happened lol) to run around 5km every day. I vary it up, sometimes i go for speed, breaking it up into 1km blocks, other times i go for time and so on. There isn't any rhyme or reason but i have read the average basketball player covers about 5km during a game. So if i can run an easy 5-6km at a good pace my hope is that is enough of a conditioning surplus to play what will probably be bench minutes at my age of 35.
adarqui:
--- Quote from: maxent on December 02, 2018, 08:36:39 am ---I was going to make a thread on conditioning for basketball and found out i already made one 6 months ago :wowthatwasnutswtf:.
--- End quote ---
lol.
--- Quote ---Literally have never been fit in my whole life and i was seduced by the idea that just playing basketball was enough to 'build endurance' for basketball. Or running some intervals lol.
--- End quote ---
i think it is for sure.. but not half court. intense full court should get you fit. adding stuff in will only help (line drills, gassers etc).
but ya, i wouldn't expect half court to get you anywhere fit for full.
playing lots of basketball increases your risk of (contact) injury though so..
--- Quote ---Probably never played that much full court basketball in any case but even when i did regularly albeit infrequently (1-2x week) i would always redline very quickly into a competive game. I'm talking about seconds into the game, probably because my adrenaline gets jacked way up and my HR maxes out almost immediately. Never figured it out but the demands on conditioning are pretty high and i don't think just 'playing ball' is a good way to train for that conditioning. Which means to me, somehow, people who do play basketball regularly and do so in good condition for the sport must have developed the fitness in a way I missed out. Maybe it was high school training which probably involved a steady diet of suicides or long steady jogs etc etc which i never did because i didn't play basketball in school.
Which brings me to the question of how do you build (basketball) fitness in someone who doesn't have it? From what ive read in studies, there are non-responders to exercise out there which turns out means only that these people need to train more (harder and longer and more often) than responders. If i consider i am a non-responder then my current approach has been (and nothing planned about it, just happened lol) to run around 5km every day. I vary it up, sometimes i go for speed, breaking it up into 1km blocks, other times i go for time and so on. There isn't any rhyme or reason but i have read the average basketball player covers about 5km during a game. So if i can run an easy 5-6km at a good pace my hope is that is enough of a conditioning surplus to play what will probably be bench minutes at my age of 35.
--- End quote ---
it'll definitely help. bball is start/stop tho. if you want to really improve your ability in game, without playing games, you need to mimic that a few times per week at least. could be part of your 5k run, just mixing it up fartlek style (sprint/jog/sprint/jog) random stuff etc. additionally, basketball is start/stop using all kinds of forward/backward/lateral movements, so - very different than linear running (which is alot easier). changing direction is rough and takes alot more energy.
but still, 5k every day is much better than nothing. it'll surely help considerably.
pc!
maxent:
--- Quote from: adarqui on December 02, 2018, 05:33:30 pm ---i think it is for sure.. but not half court. intense full court should get you fit. adding stuff in will only help (line drills, gassers etc). but ya, i wouldn't expect half court to get you anywhere fit for full.
--- End quote ---
Perhaps it ought to work for the average player but i must be a non-responder. i find a full court competitive game to be more of a 'test' and just doing that test doesn't actually get my body to adapt to becoming fitter for the sport. It's just too strenuous to be considered training. Training should be something that gives steady improvements with time. A test doesn't always do that. I know that from my experience with the sport and i understand it runs counter to what ppl think. For me it would be like doing heavy squat 1rm attempts and thinking it will make me stronger - it works, kinda, for a bit but it's not the best way to train to achieve the goal of getting stronger steadily over time. Same principle might be at work for basketball fitness. I need a way to build the fitness - a game is too much of a test than a builder.
--- Quote ---it'll definitely help. bball is start/stop tho. if you want to really improve your ability in game, without playing games, you need to mimic that a few times per week at least. could be part of your 5k run, just mixing it up fartlek style (sprint/jog/sprint/jog) random stuff etc. additionally, basketball is start/stop using all kinds of forward/backward/lateral movements, so - very different than linear running (which is alot easier). changing direction is rough and takes alot more energy. but still, 5k every day is much better than nothing. it'll surely help considerably.
--- End quote ---
Good points, i'll try that and see how it goes. I did my first long run yesterday (7km over 60 minutes). And today i'll go the other way and aim for 5km in 20 minutes in repeats of 400-500m at around 4 min/km pace. If i alternate between these two workouts every day, how does that sound? When i can eat more food (soon) i'll add in a sprint session as well but right now im at the edge of recovery between daily running + squatting.
adarqui:
--- Quote from: maxent on December 04, 2018, 10:51:32 pm ---
--- Quote from: adarqui on December 02, 2018, 05:33:30 pm ---i think it is for sure.. but not half court. intense full court should get you fit. adding stuff in will only help (line drills, gassers etc). but ya, i wouldn't expect half court to get you anywhere fit for full.
--- End quote ---
Perhaps it ought to work for the average player but i must be a non-responder. i find a full court competitive game to be more of a 'test' and just doing that test doesn't actually get my body to adapt to becoming fitter for the sport. It's just too strenuous to be considered training. Training should be something that gives steady improvements with time. A test doesn't always do that. I know that from my experience with the sport and i understand it runs counter to what ppl think. For me it would be like doing heavy squat 1rm attempts and thinking it will make me stronger - it works, kinda, for a bit but it's not the best way to train to achieve the goal of getting stronger steadily over time. Same principle might be at work for basketball fitness. I need a way to build the fitness - a game is too much of a test than a builder.
--- End quote ---
how is playing full court, frequently, a test?
it's just full court..
playing a real game in a league is a test.
i don't get your analogy.. you're using half court training and it's lack of training effect on full court basketball, to consider yourself a non-responder. that makes no sense to me IMHO.
it's just a full court pickup game. i wouldn't overthink it.
when i hooped, i played like 3-5 games of full court games per day.. i never had a problem with basketball fitness. nor did any of the regulars who came out there to play, every day. if you win a game, you stay on. if you lose, you wait for the next one while working on mechanics or something etc. works out very well at building basketball specific fitness.
some 70+ year old guy used to call next and play games with us occasionally. we had very intense games, but this guy would get into games and try to play. we kinda dreaded it sometimes, he was a liability.. but every1 respected him, he could go up and down the court. he even scored on people a few times. park would go nuts if he did.
in my opinion: if you played full court nearly every day for months and didn't make any conditioning/fitness gains + basketball specific fitness improvements, then you could label yourself a non-responder.
on the other hand, if you want to avoid full court or basketball in general, due to injury risk etc, then what you're looking to do makes more sense. ie, if you want to cross train & somehow have it prepare you for actual basketball, then yea you'll need to do what you're doing. but full court pickup games aren't tests, they are just full court games. you play them and you gain basketball specific fitness.
--- Quote ---it'll definitely help. bball is start/stop tho. if you want to really improve your ability in game, without playing games, you need to mimic that a few times per week at least. could be part of your 5k run, just mixing it up fartlek style (sprint/jog/sprint/jog) random stuff etc. additionally, basketball is start/stop using all kinds of forward/backward/lateral movements, so - very different than linear running (which is alot easier). changing direction is rough and takes alot more energy. but still, 5k every day is much better than nothing. it'll surely help considerably.
--- End quote ---
Good points, i'll try that and see how it goes. I did my first long run yesterday (7km over 60 minutes). And today i'll go the other way and aim for 5km in 20 minutes in repeats of 400-500m at around 4 min/km pace. If i alternate between these two workouts every day, how does that sound? When i can eat more food (soon) i'll add in a sprint session as well but right now im at the edge of recovery between daily running + squatting.
[/quote]
sounds like it'll work at building endurance for a while. just throw in very light runs (or rest) when you feel too run down to hit those workouts.
pc!
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