Author Topic: Various Jumpers: Plants  (Read 6794 times)

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adarqui

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Various Jumpers: Plants
« on: April 27, 2010, 03:23:14 pm »
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ok..



air up there:

















golden child:














jus fly:














t-dub:












jonesy:












mccray:











area51:













two similar dips on SVJ's (40 on the first two), and james smith low dip (ooo box squat!) / some cressey athlete (38"):


frank yang (40" jumpmat):



some WGF athlete (40" jumpmat):





smith (BOX SKWAT DAT SHIT!!! , 36" vertec):





ecressey athlete (38" jumpmat):









squatdr plant from dj



from a short run up












LBSS

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Re: Various Jumpers: Plants
« Reply #1 on: April 27, 2010, 06:46:08 pm »
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Gotta find some pics of myself for comparison: the first thing I notice is how low most of them are. I don't think I get low enough to get real power. Too worried about getting off the ground fast. But if I try to get lower, I overthink it.
Muscles are nonsensical they have nothing to do with this bullshit.

- Avishek

sunday: long very easy run 80+ mins @ 5:40+ (14+ km)
monday: strength/cross training
tuesday: easy run 60+ mins @ 5:20-5:30 (11+ km)
wednesday: fartlek (mostly easy pace with mix of strides, hills, long tempo) 45 mins (8+ km)
thursday: easy run 60+ mins @ 5:20-5:30 (11+ km), strength/cross-training
friday: rest
saturday: short tempo 6-8x500 @ sub-4:00 (7 km)

strength would be:
- hops 2x10
- box jumps or ME SVJ 2x5
- squats 3x6-8 or weighted BSS/lunges 3x10/leg
- RDL/hypers 2x10-12 or SLRDL 2x10-12/leg
- upper push myo-reps or sets to technical failure
- upper pull myo-reps or sets to technical failure
- leg raises, holds, pallof presses

adarqui

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Re: Various Jumpers: Plants
« Reply #2 on: April 27, 2010, 07:33:51 pm »
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Gotta find some pics of myself for comparison: the first thing I notice is how low most of them are. I don't think I get low enough to get real power. Too worried about getting off the ground fast. But if I try to get lower, I overthink it.

ya i buckle if i try and get lower, just not strong enough dynamically in those positions. I think for myself though, quarter-squat style depth is my preferred depth in RVJ's.. On svj's, I get like 1/8th squat depth it's ridiculous.

The one thing I know is, my plant is alot better when im mixing in plyometric/explosive exercises while squatting. If i focus purely on squatting+jumping, I go into that square bilateral heavily-strength trained plant. When I start really getting back into explosive training, depth jumps, REA squatting, double leg bounds, I then start coming back in from that side plant, looks pretty similar to golden child.

In this vid, I had been doing LOTS of rea/reactive work prior to this session. I remember just feeling ridiculous on my plants:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0kHeTJVHQQ" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0kHeTJVHQQ</a>

The first dunk miss illustrates it perfectly.. That is basically my optimal form for RVJ'n, nice angle to look at it.. I have other vids where heels are crashing, coming in too square (no rotation coming in from the side) etc, those jumps look way worse. I started noticing that during my "only squat + jump" 1-2 months of training..

pc

TKXII

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Re: Various Jumpers: Plants
« Reply #3 on: April 27, 2010, 11:38:22 pm »
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Yeah I'm also surprised at how low these people are getting. Even Jus fly, he doesn't seem to get low because he jumps so fast but he clearly is. I definitely cannot get that low but my lifts are pretty weak at the moment so that explains why. AUT looks way more quad dominant than the other jumpers - anyone think this? He doesn't seem to be reaching out as much as the others I guess, but he rarely needs much of a runup anyway, so that could explain why he is not reaching either.
"Performance during stretch-shortening cycle exercise is influenced by the visco-elastic properties of the muscle-tendon units. During stretching of an activated muscle, mechanical energy is absorbed in the tendon structures (tendon and aponeurosis) and this energy can subsequently be re-utilized if shortening of the muscle immediately follows the stretching. According to Biscotti (2000), 72% of the elastic energy restitution action comes from tendons, 28% - from contractile elements of muscles.

http://www.verkhoshansky.com/Portals/0/Presentations/Shock%20Method%20Plyometrics.pdf

Raptor

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Re: Various Jumpers: Plants
« Reply #4 on: May 27, 2010, 05:58:48 am »
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Is it just me or all these guys put in A LOT of quad in their jumps? Looks like a lot of knee stress as well.

adarqui

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Re: Various Jumpers: Plants
« Reply #5 on: May 27, 2010, 01:26:23 pm »
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Is it just me or all these guys put in A LOT of quad in their jumps? Looks like a lot of knee stress as well.

nah I see it too.. got to have very strong quads and stiff ankles to get on their level, sure glute/ham work is great (especially glute), but those guys have bionic ankles/quads in the plant.

one thing i noticed when i detrained for 6 months or so, my quads are what got most weak.. they felt "dead".. i couldnt even touch the damn rim when i just started getting back into training, it was my quads that were giving out.. i'd plant and they would turn to mush.. as my jumping is coming back, it's my quads that are feeling stronger.

pc

Raptor

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Re: Various Jumpers: Plants
« Reply #6 on: May 27, 2010, 05:17:41 pm »
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That's has been my problem all my jumping life: I can't amortizate in the quads. I might have faulty mechanics and overload the quads too much in the plant, but they ARE the limiting factor because they limit my ability to use momentum. You don't really need to be able to put out THAT much force voluntarily if you can use the accumulated kinetic force during the run-up in your plant.

But in order to do that you need to be able to stop the forward momentum and make it convert into upward thrust. To do that you need the best brakes in the world. The brakes are the quads because they prevent the knee collapse. So basically you need great quad eccentric strength to decelerate.

That's why I'm trying to forcefully decelerate after sprints... to learn to manage the high quad eccentric load... kind of like in a depth jump. I remember Adam Linkenauger recommending against a quick deceleration after a sprint as it might be injurious... but I kind of use that as an exercise in itself.

adarqui

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Re: Various Jumpers: Plants
« Reply #7 on: May 28, 2010, 05:50:05 am »
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That's has been my problem all my jumping life: I can't amortizate in the quads. I might have faulty mechanics and overload the quads too much in the plant, but they ARE the limiting factor because they limit my ability to use momentum. You don't really need to be able to put out THAT much force voluntarily if you can use the accumulated kinetic force during the run-up in your plant.

But in order to do that you need to be able to stop the forward momentum and make it convert into upward thrust. To do that you need the best brakes in the world. The brakes are the quads because they prevent the knee collapse. So basically you need great quad eccentric strength to decelerate.

That's why I'm trying to forcefully decelerate after sprints... to learn to manage the high quad eccentric load... kind of like in a depth jump. I remember Adam Linkenauger recommending against a quick deceleration after a sprint as it might be injurious... but I kind of use that as an exercise in itself.

forcefully decelerating after sprints definitely hits the quads hard, that's one benefit from all of the visual-reactive drills i used to do with the more advanced athletes.. very quick decels transitioned to re-accels. . but ya i like it..

you need to rest up, heal that knee, then get back to making progress.. dno how you're going to go 100% on things like decels etc with your knee acting up, unfortunately, cns is going to inhibit if it senses anything risky.

one thing most people don't do are back pedal sprints.. defensive backs for nfl do them a ton, but in general most athletes don't spend time reaching 'max backpedal velocity' and accelerating max during that movement.. it hits the quads hard, it's a ton of high velocity TKE's.

peace man

Raptor

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Re: Various Jumpers: Plants
« Reply #8 on: May 28, 2010, 06:39:38 am »
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What's a TKE?

Anyway, I'm guessing you need to bend quite a bit at the hips to do the backpedal sprints, right? Because you can do them standing upright and reaching back with the foot while keeping the leg almost straight...

nba8340

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Re: Various Jumpers: Plants
« Reply #9 on: May 28, 2010, 02:22:32 pm »
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yea glutes and hams are great for jumping but the jump is mostly quads it's just that if your all quads you got a muscle imbalance and most likely you will start getting some knee pain or injuries, etc

adarqui

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Re: Various Jumpers: Plants
« Reply #10 on: May 28, 2010, 02:29:35 pm »
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What's a TKE?

terminal knee extension, ie the last 20 or so degrees, hits the VMO hard.


Quote
Anyway, I'm guessing you need to bend quite a bit at the hips to do the backpedal sprints, right? Because you can do them standing upright and reaching back with the foot while keeping the leg almost straight...

well i've played around with a few styles, but you definitely have to sink the hips when accelerating during the backpedal sprints, but once you reach a top speed im pretty sure you can be pretty upright.

think im gonna do some tonight :D

peace

Raptor

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Re: Various Jumpers: Plants
« Reply #11 on: June 16, 2010, 12:14:37 pm »
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Check these plants out, at the same moment of the jumping push-off, check how the knee goes out for great jumpers vs. me:

Oynur (the guy who did the between the legs off two feet in the Sport Arena contest):



Uploaded with ImageShack.us


Dan Rogojan (a guy who did a between the legs off one foot and is a great (was a great) one leg jumper (~48 inches off one leg)):



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

Me:



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adarqui

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Re: Various Jumpers: Plants
« Reply #12 on: June 16, 2010, 04:06:53 pm »
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i can barely see the pics :/ they are thumbnail size, do you have larger ones? the title of them seems like they should be larger i see 1024x in there.

peace

Raptor

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Re: Various Jumpers: Plants
« Reply #13 on: June 17, 2010, 06:11:06 am »
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Well, they open if you click on them...

adarqui

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Re: Various Jumpers: Plants
« Reply #14 on: June 18, 2010, 07:34:29 am »
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Well, they open if you click on them...

when i was trying them originally they weren't, they were stuck on thumbnail status, they are opening up now though, odd.

ill check tomorrow.