Author Topic: Heavy Deadlifting is counter productive to explosiveness?  (Read 591 times)

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fast does lie

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Heavy Deadlifting is counter productive to explosiveness?
« on: October 01, 2017, 08:21:37 am »
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I think the legendary KingFish said that in one of the journals.

I think I am more of a posterior chain jumper than quadriceps jumper, so i am now doing some DL's.

Should I go heavy-low reps or lighter but high reps. I've been doing 8 x 135lb and 8 x 185lb, sometimes 12x.

Thanks!
33yrs | 24in SVJ | >45% BF | 227LB | 5'9 | 7'5 reach | 400lb max squat paused | 5'8 wingspan | 26in RVJ

Coming back from 2 years of inactivity!

Goal: Maintain 385-405lb squat while cutting down to 165 LB

adarqui

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Re: Heavy Deadlifting is counter productive to explosiveness?
« Reply #1 on: October 01, 2017, 10:35:17 am »
+2
I think the legendary KingFish said that in one of the journals.

I think I am more of a posterior chain jumper than quadriceps jumper, so i am now doing some DL's.

Should I go heavy-low reps or lighter but high reps. I've been doing 8 x 135lb and 8 x 185lb, sometimes 12x.

Thanks!

counter productive? seriously doubt it.

more productive than squat? seriously doubt it as well.

if someone is more of a p-chain jumper than quadriceps jumper, then squatting will probably be more p-chain than quad also, sitting back and using hips more. I mean just think about it, someone jumps and uses more p-chain .. so, wouldn't they also squat and use more p-chain as well? probably.

start off lighter + high rep (8-12's like you are doing), break in phase. After 2-4 weeks of that, throw in some 5's, and eventually 3's. Don't 1RM or let form break down.

peace

fast does lie

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Re: Heavy Deadlifting is counter productive to explosiveness?
« Reply #2 on: October 01, 2017, 10:51:55 am »
+1
Any reason why you don't deadlift? Imo you could benefit from additional P-chain work, esp a big compound movement.

Squatting heavy is good but I believe from your video of 315 (the amount your knees go over your toes) and your front squat:back squat ratio you are quad dominant, maybe even very quad dominant. This sets you up for injury if you play sports and I don't believe you can get to a 40" SVJ without a good quad:p-chain balance.

deadlifting very heavy weights is almost always counter productive to explosiveness. quads+glutes are the prime movers of quick sporting movements.

i am not against p-chain work. i do volumes of GHR raises.

go to a track meet. the fastest and most explosive athleltes are all quadzillas.

Okay I found where KF said that.

I thought DL is huge a huge glute workout.
33yrs | 24in SVJ | >45% BF | 227LB | 5'9 | 7'5 reach | 400lb max squat paused | 5'8 wingspan | 26in RVJ

Coming back from 2 years of inactivity!

Goal: Maintain 385-405lb squat while cutting down to 165 LB

adarqui

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Re: Heavy Deadlifting is counter productive to explosiveness?
« Reply #3 on: October 01, 2017, 10:58:51 am »
+1
Any reason why you don't deadlift? Imo you could benefit from additional P-chain work, esp a big compound movement.

Squatting heavy is good but I believe from your video of 315 (the amount your knees go over your toes) and your front squat:back squat ratio you are quad dominant, maybe even very quad dominant. This sets you up for injury if you play sports and I don't believe you can get to a 40" SVJ without a good quad:p-chain balance.

deadlifting very heavy weights is almost always counter productive to explosiveness. quads+glutes are the prime movers of quick sporting movements.

i am not against p-chain work. i do volumes of GHR raises.

go to a track meet. the fastest and most explosive athleltes are all quadzillas.

Okay I found where KF said that.

I thought DL is huge a huge glute workout.

ya I remember that quote from KF. great quote. agree. also agree about quadzillas, the "p-chain" obsession is ridiculously overblown. Yeah those guys have amazing glutes & hamstrings, but quads as well.

the problem with heavy deadlifting is, when does it become more of a back exercise? for athletic performance, once the DL becomes a back exercise, it's not really as productive. Unfortunately that hurts lots of people's egos and they just go nuts and keep increasing the weight.

if you take DL and SQ, you might be able to eventually lift more weight with DL, but, not nearly as much weight as SQ if you say: i'll stop adding weight to DL once it becomes a back exercise. Then, SQ completely destroys it. The only way potentially that you could do that with DL, is using SUMO DL, but then the ROM is much less and it's just pointless, focus on SQ.

pc

fast does lie

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Re: Heavy Deadlifting is counter productive to explosiveness?
« Reply #4 on: October 01, 2017, 03:29:28 pm »
+1
Yeah you're right. So what can I add to my routine that will hit the GLUTES besides the full paused squats I do.

I'm thinking about:

Barbell Hip thrusts
Stiff Leg deadlifts
lunges or bulgarian split squat

to add to my routine
33yrs | 24in SVJ | >45% BF | 227LB | 5'9 | 7'5 reach | 400lb max squat paused | 5'8 wingspan | 26in RVJ

Coming back from 2 years of inactivity!

Goal: Maintain 385-405lb squat while cutting down to 165 LB

adarqui

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Re: Heavy Deadlifting is counter productive to explosiveness?
« Reply #5 on: October 01, 2017, 03:57:07 pm »
+1
Yeah you're right. So what can I add to my routine that will hit the GLUTES besides the full paused squats I do.

I'm thinking about:

Barbell Hip thrusts
Stiff Leg deadlifts
lunges or bulgarian split squat

to add to my routine

IMHO, just RDL's and a lunge variant (preferably BSS but walking lunges or reverse lunges are arguably as effective).. squat is still #1, but those would be the assistance I would incorporate.

for me personally, I preferred lunge variants due to comfort: forward walking lunges, alternating legs, or reverse lunges. Standing reverse lunge is really solid, plus you can elevated the front foot ~6" or so and get even more glute from it.

pc!