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maxent

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Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #4770 on: March 29, 2019, 08:19:13 am »
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Weather is PERFECT nowadays for running outside and yet i haven't been. Need to fix that asap. Also i meant to ask you guys .. do my chances of a gametime dunk (in traffic) increase if i can take off further from the rim? I've looked at my videos and i always jump inside the circle. I feel like it's very hard to get that close to the rim without attracting defenders, esp with the ball. Thoughts?

It depends if you can still reliably dunk further out from the circle. What's your max dunking range?

ok ive never actually tried to dunk from further. Now that might be something i need to try!

But ive been thinking about this and actuaaaaaaaaly in full court competitive games i can barely get the 22" vertical to just hit the rim with a missed dunk inside the circle, im dreaming thinking about taking off further away as if i have that option during games (my vertical drops about 40% thanks to my shitty CV).. ha ha.

Might be a good 'training exercise' though to dunk from further?
« Last Edit: March 29, 2019, 08:31:53 am by maxent »
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

maxent

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Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #4771 on: March 29, 2019, 08:23:43 am »
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I played basketball today for 2 hours. It was brutal, im approaching glycogen depletion and it's pretty miserable trying to do anything intense for more than a couple of reps. Nevertheless it was a productive session.

i worked on my euro step. I think im playing it safe by avoiding landing the final step (i finish before the last foot lands) to avoid being called for travel but if i do take it, it will make it a pretty effective move perhaps. I tried to use it 1-1 but it just doesn't happen cos the defender is always in too good a position. I think it's prob better in the flow of the game, maybe in transition where you've got a defender who is just ahead of you but you're trying to shake him? Not sure.

might tell a story. we were playing king of the court, just startd to. the other guy went first, new guy sunk a 3. he came off, i went on, new guy sinks a 3, i come off, other guy comes on. Guy sinks another 3. He comes off. Now i know what to expect.. so i give him plenty of room so he thinks he can get his 3 off .. and i went straight up and blocked the shit out of it. Lol. I felt bad .. but he didn't hit another 3 after that

we finished up with a game of 3v3 to 21. I didnt try score, just was facilitating. Wasn't really up to it tbh .. my body was underfueld having not eaten in 16hrs. All good though.

so day 8 of the diet so far. im thinking of compromising, diet for a bit longer but add carbs back to allow better training? Not sure not sure.

My worry right now is im too heavy to play without running into high HR problems which usually happens in full court, competition games. IF i do everything perfectly, like calm myself down (i get too freaking amped up), eat clean (no sugar), sleep well, have no stress/anxiety off court .. maybe i can still contribute. But i dont feel confident being able to do it around 87.5kg court weight .. i wish i was sub 85kg :/
« Last Edit: March 29, 2019, 08:28:43 am by maxent »
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

maxent

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Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #4772 on: March 29, 2019, 10:44:50 pm »
0
Bodyweight(AM): 84.8kg (30 March)
Diet compliance: 9/10 days
Daily Squat: 133/133 days
Activity:


Morning:
     

Noon:
   

Evening:
  


Notes:
  • knees a tad sore, might rest them today and go hard tmr
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

acole14

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Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #4773 on: March 30, 2019, 01:08:16 am »
+1
Weather is PERFECT nowadays for running outside and yet i haven't been. Need to fix that asap. Also i meant to ask you guys .. do my chances of a gametime dunk (in traffic) increase if i can take off further from the rim? I've looked at my videos and i always jump inside the circle. I feel like it's very hard to get that close to the rim without attracting defenders, esp with the ball. Thoughts?

It depends if you can still reliably dunk further out from the circle. What's your max dunking range?

ok ive never actually tried to dunk from further. Now that might be something i need to try!

But ive been thinking about this and actuaaaaaaaaly in full court competitive games i can barely get the 22" vertical to just hit the rim with a missed dunk inside the circle, im dreaming thinking about taking off further away as if i have that option during games (my vertical drops about 40% thanks to my shitty CV).. ha ha.

Might be a good 'training exercise' though to dunk from further?

Yep. Also, you could probably dunk from farther out with a running SLRVJ...but if you're losing a lot of inches with an SLRVJ vs DLRVJ, it might not be any better.

Specific 'dunk conditioning' could be good too: rep your most successful game dunk with short rest, until your vertical drops off, with the aim of beating the total dunk number next session. It's not that much different from just getting your cardio in, but it would give you more confidence to go for it when you're tired in a game.

maxent

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Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #4774 on: March 30, 2019, 07:57:05 am »
+1
My SLVJ is v. modest, maybe 25-27" max in ideal conditions. I wouldn't trust it (game time) tbh. But i get you, it's a bit quicker for game time speed, best left for naturally athletic people not weight trained ones like me.

Watching the recent manu ginobili retirement video NBA put up on youtube and one of the scenes has coach pop saying something like 'keep shooting. follow thru, keep shooting. be brave and aggressive' and i think that's the kind of mindset i need to dunk in games. Im so scared of contact, when i shouldnt be,  cue walter white 'i am the danger' .. i was guarding someone today and i gently swiped at the ball while he drove full steam into the middle but he said i pushed him! i was back peddling and playing it soft to avoid fouling. If i was actually being physical .. i think it would be a different matter altogether.

i got to tell you guys, baskertball was amazing. I felt so strong and powerful .. i wore the vest for 90% of the time, i only took it off for the last game to 11, cos one dude got injured and i'd got cold and i just thought that's enough training for today, lemme have some fun. I was doing SVJ dunks with the vest on like it was nothing, the rim doesn't even give that much and i was hitting it hard enough to pull it down. The vest makes it impossible to take jumpers, but i can still do jump hooks and stuff. So i dont mind not shooting. Got some massive blocks, even with the vest on.

it got really heated and competitive cos one guy was playing very aggressive defence on me. ive got bruises on both of my arms, one of them is swollen and ive got popped blood vessels on the other arm. Thing is i was wearing a vest, i have been cutting pretty hard for 9 days (1 meal a day) and im low carbing and glyocogen depleted. but htis motherfucker was something else. i posted him up and he fouled me everytime, i didnt call it, just kept playing thru it all. he was calling ticky tacky fouls (not on me but others). afterwards we sat down and hd a chat, turns out he played pro ball .. motherfucker is 40 years old and still dunking (he's a personal trainer or something so in really good shape). he made that session intense af. I do think if he was guarding me like this in a proper game he'd have long fouled out. But it's got me down .. the guy went like 90% on 3pt shots .. (these islander team i watched on monday said something like 'i hate the way they (another team) play, it's just faggot shooting' - and i can so relate to that. it's boring when you're playing against a team just putting up shitton of jumpers. i called him out eventually said are you afraid to come into the paint (cos i was protecting it) and he was just pulling up for jumpers off screens. weak mans. But fair enough, that's the game i get it. im not quick enough to play him close on the perimeter cos he'll burn me and there was no rim protection with me out. Did eventually get one of the guards to d him up and that took him off the game. Because he'd have to score over me in inside. So he was now settling for runnign jumpers. But guards are not that bright, they dont know how to guide a player into a trap with a rim protector .. so he was still getting layups on these guys and im like wtf bro, just bring him towards me so we can trap him and i'll block his ass ha ha. He was really good, easily one of the better players ive played against skill wise. I do wonder how i'd fare in better conditions.

« Last Edit: March 30, 2019, 08:02:18 am by maxent »
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

maxent

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Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #4775 on: March 30, 2019, 11:18:03 pm »
0
Bodyweight(AM): 84.2kg (31 March)
Diet compliance: 10/10 days
Daily Squat: 134/134 days
Activity:


Morning:
     

Noon:
  BS 3x120, OHP 2x8x20 

Evening:
  Bball ~ 90 min 


Notes:
  • Ok today im legit gna rest lol. But lets see
  • Played 2v2 pickup against a really good tall dude. thing, lean, athletic, was flying around the court, had an insane 2nd jump, would rebound his miss before i could even get off hte ground. i couldnt stop him without fouling. Not good for my ego. Not sure even if i was carbed up and fresh and no vest i could keep up with him to be honest. im just a very mediocre athlete afterall
  • Alright that's the end of the low carb phase. adding them back tmr
« Last Edit: March 31, 2019, 07:08:35 am by maxent »
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

Coges

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Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #4776 on: March 31, 2019, 07:09:46 pm »
+1
Weather is PERFECT nowadays for running outside and yet i haven't been. Need to fix that asap. Also i meant to ask you guys .. do my chances of a gametime dunk (in traffic) increase if i can take off further from the rim? I've looked at my videos and i always jump inside the circle. I feel like it's very hard to get that close to the rim without attracting defenders, esp with the ball. Thoughts?

It depends if you can still reliably dunk further out from the circle. What's your max dunking range?

ok ive never actually tried to dunk from further. Now that might be something i need to try!

But ive been thinking about this and actuaaaaaaaaly in full court competitive games i can barely get the 22" vertical to just hit the rim with a missed dunk inside the circle, im dreaming thinking about taking off further away as if i have that option during games (my vertical drops about 40% thanks to my shitty CV).. ha ha.

Might be a good 'training exercise' though to dunk from further?

Yep. Also, you could probably dunk from farther out with a running SLRVJ...but if you're losing a lot of inches with an SLRVJ vs DLRVJ, it might not be any better.

Specific 'dunk conditioning' could be good too: rep your most successful game dunk with short rest, until your vertical drops off, with the aim of beating the total dunk number next session. It's not that much different from just getting your cardio in, but it would give you more confidence to go for it when you're tired in a game.

It's kind of depressing to think about but 90+% of all dunks are outside the circle unless you're a big guy with reach (6'7+). The worst thing is that this is man to man as well so if you're playing in Aus where most teams play zone it will make it even harder to get an opportunity. The way I see it you're best chances in order are- fast break, put back, cut without the ball, drive with the ball, post move. 

So yeah your chances will increase immensely if you can dunk from outside the circle. You need speed too for that which I think is the biggest factor.

*Edit- watch Olympic ball games. You see how even the US struggle for in game dunks against the zone defense. It's all big guys and fast breaks.
« Last Edit: March 31, 2019, 10:09:13 pm by Coges »
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maxent

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Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #4777 on: March 31, 2019, 11:36:33 pm »
+1
You nailed it. Im leaning towards the post move one. But i realise it's like 50-50% it will be called offensive if the ref sees i bumped the guy a bit too hard  :P. Basically spin off the defender while giving him a nice solid bump with the arm held rigid making contact above the elbow. Hope to have him off balance enough to get daylight for a jam.

Not athletic enough for a drive dunk.
Not athletic enough for a putback.
Not athletic enough to take off outside the circle.
Fast break dunk if we have a 2-1 situation and the team mate throws a lob over the defender i might be able to get it

i havent mentioned this yet but im realising a huge problem is that im a goofy jumper (RL plant, left handed). when i post up on the R block, i can surely turn on my right leg but the mechanics are wrong for finishing a dunk with my left hand bc when you finish the turn im out of position for leaping forwards. it's like doing a SVJ dunk (from further out) than i would normally doing a SVJ dunk. Maybe i should drill SVJ dunks from further out though. I never thought of that, i guess cos SVJ you tihnk straight up and down. But yea SVJ dunk from further out which means you have to propel yourself forward might be an option if i can drill it successfully.

But one thing ive been thinking of .. if I post up on the L block, yea it's not as comfortable because i have to catch the ball with my right hand .. and i'd have to plant my left leg first. But that's if i turn towards the middle. If i turn the other way (towards the baseline) .. and plant R leg first then finish with two hands with right hand dominant, maybe that's my best chance of getting a game time dunk. the problem is it will expose the ball to the defender and im not sure i can post up all that well on the R block since i have to catch / dribble with my non-dominant hand. I've yet to practice this dunk .. ive been waiting for the next dunk session .. hopefully tomorrow. If I can do this dunk as well or (*gasp*) better than from the R block then im going to get some dunks this year.
(update, yea all of this conjecture turned out to be fruitless, i tried it out tonight.)


Specific 'dunk conditioning' could be good too: rep your most successful game dunk with short rest, until your vertical drops off, with the aim of beating the total dunk number next session. It's not that much different from just getting your cardio in, but it would give you more confidence to go for it when you're tired in a game.
I can dunk all day acole, it's only a submax jump for me to do so. Things change dramatically in a full court competitive environment. todday once told me to do a dunk drill where i go coast to coast, dunk, then repeat. That's a really unnatural workout for me .. b/c i dont really dunk with a long run up .. it's usually 2-3 steps from well inside the elbow line when i practice dunking .. never dunked starting from beyond the arc. but now that i think about it. maybe i should just come to a stop at the elbow and then dunk. lol. let me try that!
« Last Edit: April 01, 2019, 09:16:11 am by maxent »
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

maxent

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Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #4778 on: March 31, 2019, 11:37:44 pm »
0
Bodyweight(AM): 84.3kg (1 April)
Diet compliance: 11/11 days
Daily Squat: 135/135 days
Activity:


Morning:
     

Noon:
  BS 6x120, 1x152.5, OHP 6x50 

Evening:
 Post dunk drill 


Notes:
  • Seeing the doc today to get my results back for the 24hr holter & echo
  • Did a carb up .. was pretty successful i'd say .. didn't eat any junk (ie fatty or sugary) just carbs and protein. Lets see what the scale bounces to tmr
« Last Edit: April 01, 2019, 10:31:44 pm by maxent »
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

maxent

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Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #4779 on: April 01, 2019, 01:28:00 am »
-2
Got the results back, echo was normal. 24hr holter was interesting, says my average HR was 79 BPM, minimum was 45 BPM (sleeping) and max HR was 188 BPM, which according to the time, i think was during ........ squats?! thats interesting cos i went for a run in the evening and i expected my HR to peak then, my watch reported around 175 from memory.

I think this means daily squatting isn't healthy. I prob wont continue this once i've reached my goal.
« Last Edit: April 01, 2019, 02:13:14 am by maxent »
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LBSS

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Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #4780 on: April 01, 2019, 03:00:36 am »
+3
bizarre interpretation of interesting but ultimately not critical data. come on, man, the daily squats have led to big strength gains and you're two-hand tomahawking the ball. yes you need to improve your cardiovascular fitness but hitting 188 BPM during a near-max effort activity makes perfect sense! it's fine!
Muscles are nonsensical they have nothing to do with this bullshit.

- Avishek

sunday: long very easy run 80+ mins @ 5:40+ (14+ km)
monday: strength/cross training
tuesday: easy run 60+ mins @ 5:20-5:30 (11+ km)
wednesday: fartlek (mostly easy pace with mix of strides, hills, long tempo) 45 mins (8+ km)
thursday: easy run 60+ mins @ 5:20-5:30 (11+ km), strength/cross-training
friday: rest
saturday: short tempo 6-8x500 @ sub-4:00 (7 km)

strength would be:
- hops 2x10
- box jumps or ME SVJ 2x5
- squats 3x6-8 or weighted BSS/lunges 3x10/leg
- RDL/hypers 2x10-12 or SLRDL 2x10-12/leg
- upper push myo-reps or sets to technical failure
- upper pull myo-reps or sets to technical failure
- leg raises, holds, pallof presses

Coges

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Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #4781 on: April 01, 2019, 07:06:12 pm »
0
You nailed it. Im leaning towards the post move one. But i realise it's like 50-50% it will be called offensive if the ref sees i bumped the guy a bit too hard  :P. Basically spin off the defender while giving him a nice solid bump with the arm held rigid making contact above the elbow. Hope to have him off balance enough to get daylight for a jam.

Not athletic enough for a drive dunk.
Not athletic enough for a putback.
Not athletic enough to take off outside the circle.
Fast break dunk if we have a 2-1 situation and the team mate throws a lob over the defender i might be able to get it

i havent mentioned this yet but im realising a huge problem is that im a goofy jumper (RL plant, left handed). when i post up on the R block, i can surely turn on my right leg but the mechanics are wrong for finishing a dunk with my left hand bc when you finish the turn im out of position for leaping forwards. it's like doing a SVJ dunk (from further out) than i would normally doing a SVJ dunk. Maybe i should drill SVJ dunks from further out though. I never thought of that, i guess cos SVJ you tihnk straight up and down. But yea SVJ dunk from further out which means you have to propel yourself forward might be an option if i can drill it successfully.

But one thing ive been thinking of .. if I post up on the L block, yea it's not as comfortable because i have to catch the ball with my right hand .. and i'd have to plant my left leg first. But that's if i turn towards the middle. If i turn the other way (towards the baseline) .. and plant R leg first then finish with two hands with right hand dominant, maybe that's my best chance of getting a game time dunk. the problem is it will expose the ball to the defender and im not sure i can post up all that well on the R block since i have to catch / dribble with my non-dominant hand. I've yet to practice this dunk .. ive been waiting for the next dunk session .. hopefully tomorrow. If I can do this dunk as well or (*gasp*) better than from the R block then im going to get some dunks this year.
(update, yea all of this conjecture turned out to be fruitless, i tried it out tonight.)

Go the post move and go hard. If the refs are half decent they won't call an offensive foul. I used to get called for a few but only on drives and in leagues where they have no semi circle rule which completely sucks. I just walked through (no ball and in my office) the L block spin to the baseline move. Seems like it could work in a game. I would lean towards a one handed finish to give you some extra height and an arm to fend off any potential defensive help.

Also, don't write off the put back. I've been in a position more times than I care to remember to put back missed layups and shots. My only in game dunk is a put back too. Most guys forget to box out too so it leaves you with more opportunity.

In regards to Todddays full court dunk suggestion I think that's a killer and would be great. It's the one thing that when you get an open court in a game it's all on you so if you are confident you'll definitely have a higher chance of dunking.
"Train as hard as possible, as often as possible, while staying as fresh as possible"
- Zatsiorsky

maxent

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Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #4782 on: April 01, 2019, 10:04:01 pm »
+1
Go the post move and go hard. If the refs are half decent they won't call an offensive foul. I used to get called for a few but only on drives and in leagues where they have no semi circle rule which completely sucks. I just walked through (no ball and in my office) the L block spin to the baseline move. Seems like it could work in a game. I would lean towards a one handed finish to give you some extra height and an arm to fend off any potential defensive help.

I've started drilling a spin dunk off the block. I need to keep the defender honest and have him in two minds that i could go towards the baseline, so ive got that counter as well. I figure i'll give him a couple of jumpers off hte glass there and then i'll spin on him. Or another way i could set it up is make it seem im going baseline (faced up before initiating the dribble) then take him baseline before spinning on him. THe benefit of this is it gives you ab it more extra momentum/speed going into the dunk. Basically what wade does below:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLJTwaOZ7Gs" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLJTwaOZ7Gs</a>

Quote
Also, don't write off the put back. I've been in a position more times than I care to remember to put back missed layups and shots. My only in game dunk is a put back too. Most guys forget to box out too so it leaves you with more opportunity.
ok i may try to drill it. will get someone to put up some shots and try put them back. ive never done one before, i usually dont have that much height when i get apuback so i end up finishing with a jump hook (in the air)

Quote
In regards to Todddays full court dunk suggestion I think that's a killer and would be great. It's the one thing that when you get an open court in a game it's all on you so if you are confident you'll definitely have a higher chance of dunking.

im on it. will do it today!
Training for sub 20 5K & 40" RVJ & 170kg BS @ 85kg bw. log entry template

maxent

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Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #4783 on: April 01, 2019, 10:29:21 pm »
+1
Bodyweight(AM): 85.5kg (2nd March)
Diet compliance: 12/12 days
Daily Squat: 136/136 days
Activity:


Morning:
     

Noon:
  BS 6x120, 1x140, OHP 6x50 

Evening:
  Post drill 


Notes:
  • Post carb rebound to 85.5kg is a good sign. Lets see how it goes the rest of the week. NO MORE FASTED TRAINING! CARBS ARE BACK ON THE MENU BOYS ETC.
  • Gym weight was a perfect 87.5kg! So i pretty much nailed my cut. Just going to maintain bw now and improve fitness and performance.
« Last Edit: April 02, 2019, 10:25:55 pm by maxent »
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Coges

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Re: chasing athleticism
« Reply #4784 on: April 01, 2019, 10:42:48 pm »
0
Go the post move and go hard. If the refs are half decent they won't call an offensive foul. I used to get called for a few but only on drives and in leagues where they have no semi circle rule which completely sucks. I just walked through (no ball and in my office) the L block spin to the baseline move. Seems like it could work in a game. I would lean towards a one handed finish to give you some extra height and an arm to fend off any potential defensive help.

I've started drilling a spin dunk off the block. I need to keep the defender honest and have him in two minds that i could go towards the baseline, so ive got that counter as well. I figure i'll give him a couple of jumpers off hte glass there and then i'll spin on him. Or another way i could set it up is make it seem im going baseline (faced up before initiating the dribble) then take him baseline before spinning on him. THe benefit of this is it gives you ab it more extra momentum/speed going into the dunk. Basically what wade does below:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLJTwaOZ7Gs" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLJTwaOZ7Gs</a>

Quote
Also, don't write off the put back. I've been in a position more times than I care to remember to put back missed layups and shots. My only in game dunk is a put back too. Most guys forget to box out too so it leaves you with more opportunity.
ok i may try to drill it. will get someone to put up some shots and try put them back. ive never done one before, i usually dont have that much height when i get apuback so i end up finishing with a jump hook (in the air)

Quote
In regards to Todddays full court dunk suggestion I think that's a killer and would be great. It's the one thing that when you get an open court in a game it's all on you so if you are confident you'll definitely have a higher chance of dunking.

im on it. will do it today!

Nice. That spin move may actually work well against zone d and could give you the option of posterising someone if yet get enough momentum.
"Train as hard as possible, as often as possible, while staying as fresh as possible"
- Zatsiorsky